美国国家公共电台 NPR--Ukraine needs more support even though Russia has fought poorly, Polish diplomat says

Ukraine needs more support even though Russia has fought poorly, Polish diplomat¹ says

Transcript²

NPR's Steve Inskeep talks to Polish Ambassador to the U.S. Marek Magierowski about Poland's support of Ukraine, and its call for more military aid in the war against Russia.

STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:

Allies of Ukraine are preparing for a second year of war. The anniversary of Russia's invasion is later this month. This means a second year of war for neighboring Poland, which has sent arms and aid to Ukraine. Poland's ambassador to the U.S. is Marek Magierowski.

MAREK MAGIEROWSKI: We had several discussions among EU ambassadors here in Washington whether we should start talking about a clash of civilizations, not the one described by Samuel Huntington in his famous book but another clash of cultures between Russia and Europe or between Russia and the West or between Russia and the free world.

INSKEEP: Poland was ruled by Russia in generations past. Faced now with Russian aggression³, it has taken a larger role in urging Europe to resist. Poland last month pressured neighboring Germany to send advanced battle tanks to Ukraine, and Germany eventually did. Poland has sent some of its own military hardware across the border. Ambassador Magierowski says Ukraine needs more support to win this war, even though Russia has fought badly.

MAGIEROWSKI: We tended to overestimate⁴ Russia's military might...

INSKEEP: Sure.

MAGIEROWSKI: ...Before the war, but I'm afraid we are now underestimating it.

INSKEEP: What do you mean?

MAGIEROWSKI: I'm not terribly optimistic about the course of this war. I think it will be a protracted⁵ conflict, if not a frozen one. I believe Putin can still flood Ukraine with manpower or cannon⁶ fodder⁷, if you will. The Russian society and especially the Russian ruling elites⁸ are much more resilient than us, than the West. It will take time, and it will take a very serious long-term effort also on our side.

INSKEEP: What does a protracted conflict mean for Poland, given that your country has already become a home for, I believe, millions of refugees?

MAGIEROWSKI: Since the beginning of the war, more than 9 million Ukrainian refugees have crossed the border with Poland. Of course, not all of them stayed in our country. Some of them emigrated to other countries in Europe. Some of them returned to Ukraine. But roughly, 1.5 million refugees did remain in our country. They enjoy many benefits. Just a month after the war, the Polish Parliament passed a law which essentially⁹ facilitates their integration¹⁰ into Polish society. And they do integrate seamlessly, impeccably into the Polish labor¹¹ market, for example. And I believe this is our - not only a political but also a personal obligation for many Poles to help our Ukrainian brethren.

INSKEEP: Poland has not always been as welcoming to refugees. There was much political frustration¹² over refugees from the Middle East, for example. What makes it easier to contemplate¹³ millions of Ukrainians in your midst for a very long time?

MAGIEROWSKI: As I said, they integrate into the Polish society extraordinarily¹⁴. They have a similar cultural background and a religious background, as well, which is of - I believe, of critical importance. They learn the language in a matter of a month. And about 95% of those refugees are women and children because we both know what the Ukrainian men are doing right now. And those women, upon arrival in Warsaw or in Krakow or in Gdansk - they never say, I want welfare. They never say, I want an allowance. I want the Polish authorities to take care of myself and of my family. They always say, I want a job - and get a job because fortunately, the Polish - the unemployment rate in Poland is now ridiculously low.

INSKEEP: The ambassador's remarks there reflect longstanding views of Poland's ruling party and also widespread European resistance to migrants in years past. More recently, Russia's allies took advantage of that sensitivity, sending Middle Eastern migrants to Poland's border. The reception for Ukrainians has been very different.

MAGIEROWSKI: It would be unfair to compare these two crises, if you will, and the Polish authorities' conduct in these two cases.

INSKEEP: If your side prevails, what does a post-war Europe look like?

MAGIEROWSKI: I - it is my firm belief that now the whole world and especially our European partners have understood how important the eastern flank is in terms of deterrence¹⁵. Deterrence is key. And that's why, for example, we are trying - we have been trying for months to convince our American partners that we need a permanent presence on Polish soil. We need more American troops. And we do believe, unlike some other politicians in Western Europe, that we still need America as a military hegemon in this part of the world, in Europe. And I can only echo the words of the Finnish prime minister, who said just a few weeks ago that without America, we would be in a completely different situation now in Europe.

INSKEEP: As many people will know, in the Cold War, Germany was the front line against the Soviet¹⁶ Union, and the United States developed a whole network of bases in Germany, many of which are still operating and very important to the United States. I think I hear you saying that if the U.S. had more bases in Poland, closer to Russia, that would be fine with you.

MAGIEROWSKI: Absolutely. Yes, of course, we are a frontline state with or without American bases because it's about geography. Russia has always been our neighbor. It is our neighbor. And it will remain so. It will not vanish.

INSKEEP: Ambassador, thanks very much for your time.

MAGIEROWSKI: My pleasure. Thank you so much.

INSKEEP: Marek Magierowski is Poland's ambassador to the United States.

1 diplomat   

n.外交官，外交家；能交际的人，圆滑的人

参考例句：

• The diplomat threw in a joke, and the tension was instantly relieved.那位外交官插进一个笑话，紧张的气氛顿时缓和下来。
• He served as a diplomat in Russia before the war.战前他在俄罗斯当外交官。

2 transcript   

n.抄本，誊本，副本，肄业证书

参考例句：

• A transcript of the tapes was presented as evidence in court.一份录音带的文字本作为证据被呈交法庭。
• They wouldn't let me have a transcript of the interview.他们拒绝给我一份采访的文字整理稿。

3 aggression   

n.进攻，侵略，侵犯，侵害

参考例句：

• So long as we are firmly united, we need fear no aggression.只要我们紧密地团结，就不必惧怕外来侵略。
• Her view is that aggression is part of human nature.她认为攻击性是人类本性的一部份。

4 overestimate   

v.估计过高，过高评价

参考例句：

• Don't overestimate seriousness of the problem.别把问题看重了。
• We overestimate our influence and our nuisance value.我们过高地估计了自己的影响力和破坏作用。

5 protracted   

adj.拖延的；延长的v.拖延“protract”的过去式和过去分词

参考例句：

• The war was protracted for four years. 战争拖延了四年。 来自《简明英汉词典》
• We won victory through protracted struggle. 经过长期的斗争，我们取得了胜利。 来自《简明英汉词典》

6 cannon   

n.大炮，火炮；飞机上的机关炮

参考例句：

• The soldiers fired the cannon.士兵们开炮。
• The cannon thundered in the hills.大炮在山间轰鸣。

7 fodder   

n.草料；炮灰

参考例句：

• Grass mowed and cured for use as fodder.割下来晒干用作饲料的草。
• Guaranteed salt intake, no matter which normal fodder.不管是那一种正常的草料，保证盐的摄取。

8 elites   

精华( elite的名词复数 )； 精锐； 上层集团； （统称）掌权人物

参考例句：

• The elites are by their nature a factor contributing to underdevelopment. 这些上层人物天生是助长欠发达的因素。
• Elites always detest gifted and nimble outsiders. 社会名流对天赋聪明、多才多艺的局外人一向嫌恶。

9 essentially   

adv.本质上，实质上，基本上

参考例句：

• Really great men are essentially modest.真正的伟人大都很谦虚。
• She is an essentially selfish person.她本质上是个自私自利的人。

10 integration   

n.一体化，联合，结合

参考例句：

• We are working to bring about closer political integration in the EU.我们正在努力实现欧盟內部更加紧密的政治一体化。
• This was the greatest event in the annals of European integration.这是欧洲统一史上最重大的事件。

11 labor   

n.劳动，努力，工作，劳工；分娩；vi.劳动，努力，苦干；vt.详细分析；麻烦

参考例句：

• We are never late in satisfying him for his labor.我们从不延误付给他劳动报酬。
• He was completely spent after two weeks of hard labor.艰苦劳动两周后，他已经疲惫不堪了。

12 frustration   

n.挫折，失败，失效，落空

参考例句：

• He had to fight back tears of frustration.他不得不强忍住失意的泪水。
• He beat his hands on the steering wheel in frustration.他沮丧地用手打了几下方向盘。

13 contemplate   

vt.盘算，计议；周密考虑；注视，凝视

参考例句：

• The possibility of war is too horrifying to contemplate.战争的可能性太可怕了，真不堪细想。
• The consequences would be too ghastly to contemplate.后果不堪设想。

14 extraordinarily   

adv.格外地；极端地

参考例句：

• She is an extraordinarily beautiful girl.她是个美丽非凡的姑娘。
• The sea was extraordinarily calm that morning.那天清晨，大海出奇地宁静。

15 deterrence   

威慑，制止； 制止物，制止因素； 挽留的事物； 核威慑

参考例句：

• An extreme school of "disarmers" pronounced stable deterrence was a dangerous deception. “裁军论者”中的极端派声称，稳定的威摄是一种危险的骗局。
• Escalation is thus an aspect of deterrence and of crisis management. 因此逐步升级是威慑和危机处理的一个方面。

16 Soviet   

adj.苏联的，苏维埃的；n.苏维埃

参考例句：

• Zhukov was a marshal of the former Soviet Union.朱可夫是前苏联的一位元帅。
• Germany began to attack the Soviet Union in 1941.德国在1941年开始进攻苏联。