美国国家公共电台 NPR Obama Warns Trump Against Relying On Executive Power

 

DAVID GREENE, HOST: 

President Obama is going through a presidential transition unlike any other. Granted, his transition to power was dramatic during economic crisis. Now, he hands off to a president-elect who pledged to reverse much of his legacy¹.

STEVE INSKEEP, HOST: 

Amid all of this, the president set for an exit interview late last week. He sat in the White House cabinet room by a fireplace draped with Christmas decorations. We talked for nearly an hour about hacking² during the election, as we heard on Friday, and much more. Many of the president's accomplishments³ came through executive actions, to the fury of Republicans who blocked him in Congress. Now, the immense power of the presidency⁴ will be turned over to a man who is not known for restraining himself.

Should President-elect Trump⁵, once he's inaugurated, use his executive powers in the same way that you have?

BARACK OBAMA: I think that he is entirely⁶ within his lawful⁷ power to do so. Keep in mind, though, that my strong preference has always been to legislate⁸ when I can get legislation done. In my first two years, I wasn't relying on executive powers because I had big majorities in the Congress, and we were able to get bills done, get bills passed.

And even after we lost the majorities in Congress, I bent⁹ over backwards¹⁰ consistently to try to find compromise and a legislative¹¹ solution to some of the big problems that we've got, a classic example being immigration reform, where I held off for years in taking some of the executive actions that I ultimately took in pursuit of a bipartisan solution - one that, by the way, did pass through the Senate on a bipartisan basis with our help. I was very proud of that.

I went out of my way to make sure our help was behind the scenes so that Republicans didn't feel as if it was going to hurt them politically. At the end of the day, John Boehner and the House Republicans couldn't pull the trigger on getting it done. And it was only then, after we had exhausted¹² efforts for bipartisan reform, that we took some additional steps on - on immigration executive actions. So my suggestion to the president-elect is, you know, going through the legislative process is always better, in part because it's harder to undo¹³.

INSKEEP: Acting¹⁴ on his own, President Obama gave temporary legal status to people who were brought to the United States illegally as children. And then there's President Obama's Clean Power Plan, which fights climate change and was done through regulation, not written into law. The custodian¹⁵ of these and other initiatives will now be Donald Trump.

OBAMA: That doesn't mean, though, that he is not going to come in and look at the various agencies and see the rules we've passed. And if he wants to reverse some of those rules, that's part of the democratic process. That's, you know, why I tell people to vote - because it turns out elections mean something.

INSKEEP: And this election means even more because the presidency, as has been widely noted¹⁶, is so powerful. It's grown more powerful over generations. You used your power in certain ways and even in ways that you'd suggest in the past might be beyond - beyond your authority.

OBAMA: Well, no, I don't think I've done that.

INSKEEP: If I'm thinking of immigration, for example.

OBAMA: Well, what I - what I said with immigration reform was that I couldn't simply sign a document that legalized 11 million people who had come here illegally and were currently undocumented. What I could do is find categories of people where we could not prioritize as significant risks. But what I always said was we couldn't solve the basic problem of these folks being in the shadows without legislation.

INSKEEP: After he deferred¹⁷ deporting¹⁸ people brought us children, the president was asked if he could protect the parents of citizens, too. He expressed his doubts, then later tried to do it before being blocked in the courts.

The question for me is, has the presidency become too powerful, in your view?

OBAMA: I distinguish between domestic policy and foreign policy.

INSKEEP: On foreign policy, Obama's answer is maybe, yes, the president does have too much power. He spent the entire time that he was in office sending American troops into battle in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and beyond. It's all been done without much input¹⁹ from Congress.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED BROADCAST)

OBAMA: Congress starts feeling pretty comfortable with just having the president do all this stuff and not really having to weigh in. So for example, we're still operating in our fight against ISIL without a new congressional authorization²⁰. It's the authorization that dates back to 9/11. And - and I think that is an area that we have to worry about.

The president and the executive branch are always going to have greater latitude²¹ and greater authority when it comes to protecting America because sometimes you just have to respond quickly and not everything that is a danger can be publicized and be subject to open debate, but there have to be some guardrails.

And what we've had to do on things like drones or the NSA or a number of the tools that we use to penetrate²² terrorist networks, what we've had to do is to build this - the guardrails internally - essentially²³ set up a whole series of processes to guard against government overreach, to reform some practices that I thought, over time, would threaten civil liberties.

You know, there are some critics on the left who would argue we haven't gone far enough on that. I would argue that we've gotten it about right, although I'll - I'm the first one to admit that we didn't get it all right on day one. There were times where, for example, with respect to drones, that I had to kind of stop the system for a second and say, you know what?

We're getting too comfortable with our ability to take kinetic²⁴ strikes around the world without having enough process to avoid consistently the kinds of civilian²⁵ casualties that can end up actually hurting us in the war against radicalization.

INSKEEP: In our talk, the outgoing executive says he is also concerned about the president's use of power at home. President Obama's critics said he acted far too much through regulations which are meant to put laws into action. The president says he agrees. He'd rather that a president not do that too much.

OBAMA: I think that what's happened that I do worry about is that Congress has become so dysfunctional that more and more of a burden is placed on the agencies to fill in the gaps. And the gaps get bigger and bigger because they're not constantly refreshed and tweaked. Let's go back to something like the Affordable²⁶ Care Act.

I could not be prouder of the fact that the uninsured rate has never been lower, that 20 million people have health insurance that we didn't have before. But I said when the bill passed that it wasn't perfect. Over the course of six years of implementing²⁷ a very complicated piece of legislation that affects one-sixth of the economy that there were going to be things we learned that would allow us to improve it.

And I don't know how many times I've said to Republicans, both publicly and privately²⁸, in State of the Union speeches and on - in town halls around the country, that if they're willing to engage and work with me, then we can identify ways to tweak and improve this system so that more people have health insurance and it works even better and it's more stable and build on the things that seemed to have worked - for example, the fact that we've actually slowed the growth of health care costs since the bill passed.

And in each - each time I've said this, the basic Republican response has been, no, all we want to do is repeal²⁹ it, and we'll replace it with something later. And they're still saying that now post-election.

INSKEEP: Which is one irony³⁰ of this presidential transition. Republicans insisted for years that the president must work through Congress, however hostile or dysfunctional it might be. Now, it is up to Republicans, in charge of Congress and the White House, to work through that same process.

OBAMA: The bottom line is, if you want to right-size executive power relative to the other branches of government, the best way to do that is to have a healthy Congress in which the two parties are debating, disagreeing, but also occasionally working together to pass legislation.

INSKEEP: President Obama just over a month before leaving office

1 legacy   

n.遗产，遗赠；先人(或过去)留下的东西

参考例句：

• They are the most precious cultural legacy our forefathers left.它们是我们祖先留下来的最宝贵的文化遗产。
• He thinks the legacy is a gift from the Gods.他认为这笔遗产是天赐之物。

2 hacking   

n.非法访问计算机系统和数据库的活动

参考例句：

• The patient with emphysema is hacking all day. 这个肺气肿病人整天不断地干咳。
• We undertook the task of hacking our way through the jungle. 我们负责在丛林中开路。

3 accomplishments   

n.造诣；完成( accomplishment的名词复数 )；技能；成绩；成就

参考例句：

• It was one of the President's greatest accomplishments. 那是总统最伟大的成就之一。
• Among her accomplishments were sewing,cooking,playing the piano and dancing. 她的才能包括缝纫、烹调、弹钢琴和跳舞。 来自《现代英汉综合大词典》

4 presidency   

n.总统(校长，总经理)的职位(任期)

参考例句：

• Roosevelt was elected four times to the presidency of the United States.罗斯福连续当选四届美国总统。
• Two candidates are emerging as contestants for the presidency.两位候选人最终成为总统职位竞争者。

5 trump   

n.王牌，法宝；v.打出王牌，吹喇叭

参考例句：

• He was never able to trump up the courage to have a showdown.他始终鼓不起勇气摊牌。
• The coach saved his star player for a trump card.教练保留他的明星选手，作为他的王牌。

6 entirely   

ad.全部地，完整地；完全地，彻底地

参考例句：

• The fire was entirely caused by their neglect of duty. 那场火灾完全是由于他们失职而引起的。
• His life was entirely given up to the educational work. 他的一生统统献给了教育工作。

7 lawful   

adj.法律许可的，守法的，合法的

参考例句：

• It is not lawful to park in front of a hydrant.在消火栓前停车是不合法的。
• We don't recognised him to be the lawful heir.我们不承认他为合法继承人。

8 legislate   

vt.制定法律；n.法规，律例；立法

参考例句：

• Therefore,it is very urgent to legislate for the right of privacy.因此，为隐私权立法刻不容缓。
• It's impossible to legislate for every contingency.为每一偶发事件都立法是不可能的。

9 bent   

n.爱好，癖好；adj.弯的；决心的，一心的

参考例句：

• He was fully bent upon the project.他一心扑在这项计划上。
• We bent over backward to help them.我们尽了最大努力帮助他们。

10 backwards   

adv.往回地，向原处，倒，相反，前后倒置地

参考例句：

• He turned on the light and began to pace backwards and forwards.他打开电灯并开始走来走去。
• All the girls fell over backwards to get the party ready.姑娘们迫不及待地为聚会做准备。

11 legislative   

n.立法机构，立法权；adj.立法的，有立法权的

参考例句：

• Congress is the legislative branch of the U.S. government.国会是美国政府的立法部门。
• Today's hearing was just the first step in the legislative process.今天的听证会只是展开立法程序的第一步。

12 exhausted   

adj.极其疲惫的，精疲力尽的

参考例句：

• It was a long haul home and we arrived exhausted.搬运回家的这段路程特别长，到家时我们已筋疲力尽。
• Jenny was exhausted by the hustle of city life.珍妮被城市生活的忙乱弄得筋疲力尽。

13 undo   

vt.解开，松开；取消，撤销

参考例句：

• His pride will undo him some day.他的傲慢总有一天会毁了他。
• I managed secretly to undo a corner of the parcel.我悄悄地设法解开了包裹的一角。

14 acting   

n.演戏，行为，假装；adj.代理的，临时的，演出用的

参考例句：

• Ignore her,she's just acting.别理她，她只是假装的。
• During the seventies,her acting career was in eclipse.在七十年代，她的表演生涯黯然失色。

15 custodian   

n.保管人，监护人；公共建筑看守

参考例句：

• Benitez believes his custodian is among the top five in world football.贝尼特斯坚信他的门将是当今足坛最出色的五人之一。
• When his father died his uncle became his legal custodian.他父亲死后，他叔叔成了他的法定监护人。

16 noted   

adj.著名的，知名的

参考例句：

• The local hotel is noted for its good table.当地的那家酒店以餐食精美而著称。
• Jim is noted for arriving late for work.吉姆上班迟到出了名。

17 deferred   

adj.延期的，缓召的v.拖延，延缓，推迟( defer的过去式和过去分词 )；服从某人的意愿，遵从

参考例句：

• The department deferred the decision for six months. 这个部门推迟了六个月才作决定。
• a tax-deferred savings plan 延税储蓄计划

18 deporting   

v.将…驱逐出境( deport的现在分词 )；举止

参考例句：

19 input   

n.输入(物)；投入；vt.把(数据等)输入计算机

参考例句：

• I will forever be grateful for his considerable input.我将永远感激他的大量投入。
• All this information had to be input onto the computer.所有这些信息都必须输入计算机。

20 authorization   

n.授权，委任状

参考例句：

• Anglers are required to obtain prior authorization from the park keeper.垂钓者必须事先得到公园管理者的许可。
• You cannot take a day off without authorization.未经批准你不得休假。

21 latitude   

n.纬度，行动或言论的自由(范围)，(pl.)地区

参考例句：

• The latitude of the island is 20 degrees south.该岛的纬度是南纬20度。
• The two cities are at approximately the same latitude.这两个城市差不多位于同一纬度上。

22 penetrate   

v.透(渗)入；刺入，刺穿；洞察，了解

参考例句：

• Western ideas penetrate slowly through the East.西方观念逐渐传入东方。
• The sunshine could not penetrate where the trees were thickest.阳光不能透入树木最浓密的地方。

23 essentially   

adv.本质上，实质上，基本上

参考例句：

• Really great men are essentially modest.真正的伟人大都很谦虚。
• She is an essentially selfish person.她本质上是个自私自利的人。

24 kinetic   

adj.运动的；动力学的

参考例句：

• There exist many sources of energy both potential and kinetic.存在着许多势能和动能的能源。
• The kinetic theory of gases is the best known example.气体动力学理论就是最有名的例子。

25 civilian   

adj.平民的，民用的，民众的

参考例句：

• There is no reliable information about civilian casualties.关于平民的伤亡还没有确凿的信息。
• He resigned his commission to take up a civilian job.他辞去军职而从事平民工作。

26 affordable   

adj.支付得起的，不太昂贵的

参考例句：

• The rent for the four-roomed house is affordable.四居室房屋的房租付得起。
• There are few affordable apartments in big cities.在大城市中没有几所公寓是便宜的。

27 implementing   

v.实现( implement的现在分词 )；执行；贯彻；使生效

参考例句：

• -- Implementing a comprehensive drug control strategy. ――实行综合治理的禁毒战略。 来自汉英非文学 - 白皮书
• He was in no hurry about implementing his unshakable principle. 他并不急于实行他那不可动摇的原则。 来自辞典例句

28 privately   

adv.以私人的身份，悄悄地，私下地

参考例句：

• Some ministers admit privately that unemployment could continue to rise.一些部长私下承认失业率可能继续升高。
• The man privately admits that his motive is profits.那人私下承认他的动机是为了牟利。

29 repeal   

n.废止，撤消；v.废止，撤消

参考例句：

• He plans to repeal a number of current policies.他计划废除一些当前的政策。
• He has made out a strong case for the repeal of the law.他提出强有力的理由，赞成废除该法令。

30 irony   

n.反语，冷嘲；具有讽刺意味的事，嘲弄

参考例句：

• She said to him with slight irony.她略带嘲讽地对他说。
• In her voice we could sense a certain tinge of irony.从她的声音里我们可以感到某种讥讽的意味。