美国国家公共电台 NPR 'It Is Neither Nor, It Is Both': Tom Hanks Finds No Easy Answers In 'The Circle'

 

MICHEL MARTIN, HOST:

Not trying to be nosy¹, but have you posted anything on social media today? Maybe you took a pic of your tasty brunch², maybe you sent out a video of your child's latest steps, maybe you sent up a flare³ about a faltering⁴ relationship. And when you hit that button, at any point, did you wonder how much sharing is too much? Those are just a couple of the questions behind "The Circle," a new film based on a 2013 Dave Eggers' novel of the same name.

The film takes place sometime in the future at a company called The Circle. It's kind of a hybrid⁵ of big tech companies, like Google, Facebook and Apple. And it paints a satirical and unsettling picture of life in the age of social media and tech-obsessed culture. It stars Emma Watson as Mae Holland, a new hire at The Circle, who quickly rises through the ranks and comes to embody⁶ the company's mantra that sharing is caring by agreeing to broadcast her every waking moment to millions of followers⁷ on social media. And the boss, The Circle co-founder Eamon Bailey, the seemingly easygoing co-founder, who espouses⁸ that philosophy of total transparency, that would be two-time Oscar winner Tom Hanks.

(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "THE CIRCLE")

TOM HANKS: (As Eamon Bailey) I am a believer in the perfectibility of human beings. When we are our best selves, the possibilities are endless. There isn't a problem that we cannot solve. We can cure any disease, and we can end hunger. And without secrets, without the hoarding⁹ of knowledge and information, we can finally realize our potential.

MARTIN: And we are joined now by Tom Hanks. Tom Hanks, thanks so much for speaking with us.

HANKS: You're quite welcome. You don't have any argument with that, do you? I mean, everything that guy said was just kind of great, wasn't it?

MARTIN: Well, tell us about that, why not?

(LAUGHTER)

MARTIN: Tell us - so tell us about Eamon Bailey. He feels familiar. A little bit of...

HANKS: Yeah.

MARTIN: ...Steve Jobs maybe, other public figures from the tech world. But is it OK to point out that there's something increasingly sinister¹⁰ - right? - as the movie progresses about his vision?

HANKS: Well, if you believe that complete openness will be the great guide for humanity and would lead us to unprecedented¹¹ problem-solving, that means you would then have to close off one basic need for the human condition, which I think is anonymity¹² and privacy. That is something that is put forward in everything that Eamon Bailey says - one of the intriguing¹³ aspects of it when I first read Dave Eggers' novels, which by the way, for 2013, was pretty prescient, I must say. Here we are four years later, and much of what he wrote about is, in fact, a fact.

There's nothing that he says that is not upbeat and positive and proactive and good for the world, except for everything that he stands for (laughter). So somehow there is something that is really quite malevolent¹⁴ about this concept that when everybody knows everybody's secrets, there will be no more secrets, no reason for shame, no reason for hiding, no need for lies.

That almost strikes me as something Lenin and Marx would try to put forward, which is counter to what human beings crave¹⁵ in the course of their life, which is some degree of total self-control as opposed to giving over to grand control.

MARTIN: Well, that's one of the things that's fascinating about this film is that Mother Jones, which is, you know, a left-leaning publication, and the National Review, which is a right-leaning publication, are both telling people they have to go see it, which is fascinating to me.

HANKS: (Laughter).

MARTIN: So is this a conservative movie or is this a liberal movie?

HANKS: This is a fascinating question that you pose because it's neither nor. It is both. And that's a hard concept to grasp. One aspect of it is, like, let's imagine that you have started a company, or let's just - let's take Uber. Uber would love it if there were no cars left in the world except theirs and nobody drove anywhere except their drivers and passengers all paid into the Uber system.

That is the prime fantasy of any company that provides a service is to wipe out all competition and hold not just a monopoly but enter into literally¹⁶ the human zeitgeist that life cannot go on without their services. But the question of complete control and complete dominance of a marketplace means complete control and complete dominance of your daily life. That it is malevolent.

MARTIN: So how would you describe this to somebody who didn't know anything about it? You know, at some point, the film is funny, is charming, but it also raises some very troubling questions. And it also describes scenarios¹⁷ that are not in the future, that are here now. And so I'm asking you, what is this movie? Is this dystopian? Is this funny? Is this - what is this?

HANKS: I think it's an examination of the trade-off. And you have to determine two things - one, can your life survive by - in this trade-off that you make? And is it a trade-off that you want to make? Bill Paxton and Glenne Headley play Emma Watson's parents. And Bill's character, her dad, has MS, and they cannot afford the insurance that goes along with it. But because Mae now works for The Circle, they're included. And suddenly a world of worry is taken off their plate. He is able to get treatment. He's able to get everything that one would need in living with something like MS, and it's a fabulous¹⁸ boon¹⁹ to their lives.

The trade-off they make is that The Circle puts cameras in their homes in order to make sure he's always OK. And if he falls down when he's by himself, the folks at The Circle will be able to send help. Now, do you want to live in a home where somebody from an organization has constant access to what's going on to all of your rooms? There is the trade-off.

I don't know if popular culture can handle that kind of comme ci, comme ca aspect of it because you'd like to have a - you'd like to find out specifically is it good or bad? What - let's - what do you mean by this movie? Are we supposed to love it or hate it? The question is exactly, are you supposed to love it or are you supposed to hate it?

MARTIN: Can I ask you - there are a number of artists who feel a particular sense of urgency in this particular political moment.

HANKS: Oh, yeah, sure.

MARTIN: They seem to feel a particular urgency to speak out about particular things. I'm thinking about your colleague Meryl Streep, who's certainly - if you have any peer in Hollywood, it would be she. There are a number...

HANKS: I'll take that (laughter).

MARTIN: Yeah, well, there you are. And - but I'm asking you do you feel, as an artist, any particular sense of urgency right now? And if so, to what end? I think it's - and not to really narrow you down but merely to say do you feel, as an artist, you have any particular role right now that you didn't have a year ago or two years ago?

HANKS: No, I actually think I have the same exact role because I do have a very particular perspective on this. Not to speak for Meryl, but I think she was responding to ridicule²⁰ of somebody with a physical affliction, which ain't right. And it's not fair no matter who does it. If I was going to put forward any sort of life philosophy on this is mine takes history into account. We have been at this place before, and weathering it and correcting it over a long haul, over a long period of time has made us a better country and has actually powered us on to being a even better example to the rest of the world.

I grew up during Vietnam. I was 13. I was not threatened by Vietnam in any way, shape or form. But at my dinner table, there were arguments and fistfights over Vietnam. In the city I lived in, there were riots and gunfire and burning buildings because of Vietnam. There was civil unrest, and there was the reaction to it. There were the Hard Hats - your country, love it or leave it. At the same exact time, there were people who were, in fact, leaving our country because they could not consciously go off and fight the war in Vietnam. We weathered it. We made decisions. People showed up. They got involved. Artists raised their voices and started screaming. Other people found their voice for the very first time on either side of the divide.

And what came out of it was really quite, I think, quite frankly²¹, from the layman's historian perspective that I have, a sober judgment²² of what that period of time did to us. And it prompted people to take action both by what they believed in from the get-go and what they learned throughout the process of it. We are in that same exact place right now.

But three years from now, we will be better. We will be a better nation on both sides of the divide by the way, on both sides of whatever the aisle²³ is that separates all of us because we will have examined it, we will have suffered it, we will have promoted what we think is the good fight.

MARTIN: That is two-time Oscar winner Tom Hanks. He was kind enough to join us from our studios in New York to talk about his new film "The Circle," which is out this week. Tom Hanks, thank you so much for speaking with us.

HANKS: Thank you.

1 nosy   

adj.鼻子大的，好管闲事的，爱追问的；n.大鼻者

参考例句：

• Our nosy neighbours are always looking in through our windows.好管闲事的邻居总是从我们的窗口望进来。
• My landlord is so nosy.He comes by twice a month to inspect my apartment.我的房东很烦人，他每个月都要到我公寓视察两次。

2 brunch   

n.早午餐

参考例句：

• They eat much the same thing for brunch every day.每天早午餐他们总是吃同样的东西。
• What did you have for your brunch?你早午饭都吃些什么？

3 flare   

v.闪耀，闪烁；n.潮红；突发

参考例句：

• The match gave a flare.火柴发出闪光。
• You need not flare up merely because I mentioned your work.你大可不必因为我提到你的工作就动怒。

4 faltering   

犹豫的，支吾的，蹒跚的

参考例句：

• The economy shows no signs of faltering. 经济没有衰退的迹象。
• I canfeel my legs faltering. 我感到我的腿在颤抖。

5 hybrid   

n.(动，植）杂种，混合物

参考例句：

• That is a hybrid perpetual rose.那是一株杂交的四季开花的蔷薇。
• The hybrid was tall,handsome,and intelligent.那混血儿高大、英俊、又聪明。

6 embody   

vt.具体表达，使具体化；包含，收录

参考例句：

• The latest locomotives embody many new features. 这些最新的机车具有许多新的特色。
• Hemingway's characters plainly embody his own values and view of life.海明威笔下的角色明确反映出他自己的价值观与人生观。

7 followers   

追随者( follower的名词复数 )； 用户； 契据的附面； 从动件

参考例句：

• the followers of Mahatma Gandhi 圣雄甘地的拥护者
• The reformer soon gathered a band of followers round him. 改革者很快就获得一群追随者支持他。

8 espouses   

v.（决定）支持，拥护（目标、主张等）( espouse的第三人称单数 )

参考例句：

• She followed the feminist movement; The candidate espouses Republican ideals. 她支持女权运动；这个侯选人支持共和党人的观点。 来自互联网
• Give me a break – every decent company espouses these things! 让我歇歇吧–每一个正规公司都赞成这些！ 来自互联网

9 hoarding   

n.贮藏；积蓄；临时围墙；囤积v.积蓄并储藏（某物）( hoard的现在分词 )

参考例句：

• After the war, they were shot for hoarding. 战后他们因囤积而被枪决。 来自《简明英汉词典》
• Actually he had two unused ones which he was hoarding up. 其实他还藏了两片没有用呢。 来自英汉文学

10 sinister   

adj.不吉利的，凶恶的，左边的

参考例句：

• There is something sinister at the back of that series of crimes.在这一系列罪行背后有险恶的阴谋。
• Their proposals are all worthless and designed out of sinister motives.他们的建议不仅一钱不值，而且包藏祸心。

11 unprecedented   

adj.无前例的，新奇的

参考例句：

• The air crash caused an unprecedented number of deaths.这次空难的死亡人数是空前的。
• A flood of this sort is really unprecedented.这样大的洪水真是十年九不遇。

12 anonymity   

n.the condition of being anonymous

参考例句：

• Names of people in the book were changed to preserve anonymity. 为了姓名保密，书中的人用的都是化名。
• Our company promises to preserve the anonymity of all its clients. 我们公司承诺不公开客户的姓名。

13 intriguing   

adj.有趣的；迷人的v.搞阴谋诡计(intrigue的现在分词)；激起…的好奇心

参考例句：

• These discoveries raise intriguing questions. 这些发现带来了非常有趣的问题。
• It all sounds very intriguing. 这些听起来都很有趣。 来自《简明英汉词典》

14 malevolent   

adj.有恶意的，恶毒的

参考例句：

• Why are they so malevolent to me?他们为什么对我如此恶毒？
• We must thwart his malevolent schemes.我们决不能让他的恶毒阴谋得逞。

15 crave   

vt.渴望得到，迫切需要，恳求，请求

参考例句：

• Many young children crave attention.许多小孩子渴望得到关心。
• You may be craving for some fresh air.你可能很想呼吸呼吸新鲜空气。

16 literally   

adv.照字面意义，逐字地；确实

参考例句：

• He translated the passage literally.他逐字逐句地翻译这段文字。
• Sometimes she would not sit down till she was literally faint.有时候，她不走到真正要昏厥了，决不肯坐下来。

17 scenarios   

n.[意]情节；剧本；事态；脚本

参考例句：

• Further, graphite cores may be safer than non-graphite cores under some accident scenarios. 再者，根据一些事故解说，石墨堆芯可比非石墨堆芯更安全一些。 来自英汉非文学 - 环境法 - 环境法
• Again, scenarios should make it clear which modes are acceptable to users in various contexts. 同样，我们可以运用场景剧本来搞清楚在不同情境下哪些模式可被用户接受。 来自About Face 3交互设计精髓

18 fabulous   

adj.极好的；极为巨大的；寓言中的，传说中的

参考例句：

• We had a fabulous time at the party.我们在晚会上玩得很痛快。
• This is a fabulous sum of money.这是一笔巨款。

19 boon   

n.恩赐，恩物，恩惠

参考例句：

• A car is a real boon when you live in the country.在郊外居住，有辆汽车确实极为方便。
• These machines have proved a real boon to disabled people.事实证明这些机器让残疾人受益匪浅。

20 ridicule   

v.讥讽，挖苦；n.嘲弄

参考例句：

• You mustn't ridicule unfortunate people.你不该嘲笑不幸的人。
• Silly mistakes and queer clothes often arouse ridicule.荒谬的错误和古怪的服装常会引起人们的讪笑。

21 frankly   

adv.坦白地，直率地；坦率地说

参考例句：

• To speak frankly, I don't like the idea at all.老实说，我一点也不赞成这个主意。
• Frankly speaking, I'm not opposed to reform.坦率地说，我不反对改革。

22 judgment   

n.审判；判断力，识别力，看法，意见

参考例句：

• The chairman flatters himself on his judgment of people.主席自认为他审视人比别人高明。
• He's a man of excellent judgment.他眼力过人。

23 aisle   

n.（教堂、教室、戏院等里的）过道，通道

参考例句：

• The aisle was crammed with people.过道上挤满了人。
• The girl ushered me along the aisle to my seat.引座小姐带领我沿着通道到我的座位上去。