美国国家公共电台 NPR Wikipedia Founder Says Internet Users Are Adrift In The 'Fake News' Era

 

ARI SHAPIRO, HOST:

How do you tell what's real from what's not on the Internet, especially when paid foreign agents and political operatives are working hard to create believable stories that are complete fiction? This is something Wikipedia co-founder Jimmy Wales has been thinking about. This week, he delivered the keynote address at an international media forum¹ on the topic, and he joins us now from London. Welcome.

JIMMY WALES: Thank you.

SHAPIRO: I think a lot of the Internet giants - Facebook, YouTube, Wikipedia - were founded on a kind of idealistic hope that the more open and connected people were online, the better things would be for everyone. Do you still hold that belief?

WALES: Yeah, very much. In this era where we've seen the rise of these fake news websites and so forth², Wikipedia has had almost no problems with this at all simply because our community is quite - you know, it's their hobby to debate about the quality of sources. And it's very difficult to fool the Wikipedia community with this.

SHAPIRO: The Internet has certainly had a problem with this. And some would say it is a problem of too many people having too much access being able to offer too freely ideas that are completely made up.

WALES: (Laughter) Yeah, well, that's just human life. All of us have a few idiot friends, and now they can share stuff on Facebook. The thing is, it's easy to be a little bit condescending³ about these people and to joke about idiots sharing nonsense. But the truth is, in free societies, people have a right to not be interested in the news. But when you're not that interested in the news and you do decide, hey, I think I want to find out some information, you still deserve to get quality information. And that's what we've really been lacking.

SHAPIRO: There is now so much money and power resting in the distortion of the narrative⁴, whether you're talking about a country like Russia acting⁵ in its geopolitical interest or a political activist⁶ who's willing to spend millions of dollars to get someone elected who will pursue a specific policy. When there is that much at stake, aren't the people who are fighting for factual accuracy going to be forever outgunned?

WALES: We're getting there. I mean, a lot of people say they've lost trust in the media, and they think everything is propaganda. And then it becomes very hard to come to any kind of a consensus⁷ in society where we say, well, look; you and I disagree on a certain policy, but here are some facts underlying⁸ it, and we can at least agree on those facts, whereas now I feel like a lot of people are just adrift. They don't know what to believe.

SHAPIRO: Is there one step that you think people could do that would go some distance towards undoing⁹ some of this problem?

WALES: Maybe one step that a lot of people could do is immediately take a more skeptical¹⁰ attitude towards things that you're sharing online. Just take a second, and look in a search engine. Check some of the keywords and terms, and just make sure you're not adding to the problem.

SHAPIRO: Do you think hundreds of millions of Americans are actually going to do that?

WALES: It's not required that everybody do it. As long as some people in our social circles are vigilant¹¹ about this sort of thing, they can raise the alarm. I'll give an example. I nearly posted something. So here was this story that said scientists have confirmed that if your cat was big enough, it would eat you. And that's a funny story, right?

SHAPIRO: (Laughing) It's a great story.

WALES: And we all kind of - we kind of believe it about cats, right?

SHAPIRO: Right.

WALES: And I was about to share it to my daughter. And I just thought, I'm going to google this quickly. And I did. And what I found was it linked to an original study. I opened that PDF, and I looked through it. And you know what? the study absolutely said nothing of the sort. So I didn't share it, and that was a good thing.

And I felt like, whew, I nearly got duped by a great story. I mean, that's the thing. A lot of the things that do go viral, they go viral because you hear it, and you chuckle¹². And you're like, that's great. And it confirms something you believe is probably true anyway. So you just blast it off, and you've just been fooled.

SHAPIRO: That's a great story, but I can also imagine a lot of listeners saying, I would never have taken those steps - open a PDF, read a scientific study. I see something funny on Facebook. I send it to my kid.

WALES: (Laughter) Yeah, well, think again. You might be sharing fake news.

SHAPIRO: Jimmy Wales, thank you so much for talking with us today.

WALES: Yes. Thank you.

SHAPIRO: He's the co-founder of Wikipedia. And this week, he gave the keynote address at the Westminster Media Forum titled "Next Steps For Tackling Fake News."

1 forum   

n.论坛，讨论会

参考例句：

• They're holding a forum on new ways of teaching history.他们正在举行历史教学讨论会。
• The organisation would provide a forum where problems could be discussed.这个组织将提供一个可以讨论问题的平台。

2 forth   

adv.向前；向外，往外

参考例句：

• The wind moved the trees gently back and forth.风吹得树轻轻地来回摇晃。
• He gave forth a series of works in rapid succession.他很快连续发表了一系列的作品。

3 condescending   

adj.谦逊的,故意屈尊的

参考例句：

• He has a condescending attitude towards women. 他对女性总是居高临下。
• He tends to adopt a condescending manner when talking to young women. 和年轻女子说话时，他喜欢摆出一副高高在上的姿态。

4 narrative   

n.叙述，故事；adj.叙事的，故事体的

参考例句：

• He was a writer of great narrative power.他是一位颇有记述能力的作家。
• Neither author was very strong on narrative.两个作者都不是很善于讲故事。

5 acting   

n.演戏，行为，假装；adj.代理的，临时的，演出用的

参考例句：

• Ignore her,she's just acting.别理她，她只是假装的。
• During the seventies,her acting career was in eclipse.在七十年代，她的表演生涯黯然失色。

6 activist   

n.活动分子，积极分子

参考例句：

• He's been a trade union activist for many years.多年来他一直是工会的积极分子。
• He is a social activist in our factory.他是我厂的社会活动积极分子。

7 consensus   

n.(意见等的)一致，一致同意，共识

参考例句：

• Can we reach a consensus on this issue?我们能在这个问题上取得一致意见吗？
• What is the consensus of opinion at the afternoon meeting?下午会议上一致的意见是什么？

8 underlying   

adj.在下面的，含蓄的，潜在的

参考例句：

• The underlying theme of the novel is very serious.小说隐含的主题是十分严肃的。
• This word has its underlying meaning.这个单词有它潜在的含义。

9 undoing   

n.毁灭的原因，祸根；破坏，毁灭

参考例句：

• That one mistake was his undoing. 他一失足即成千古恨。
• This hard attitude may have led to his undoing. 可能就是这种强硬的态度导致了他的垮台。

10 skeptical   

adj.怀疑的，多疑的

参考例句：

• Others here are more skeptical about the chances for justice being done.这里的其他人更为怀疑正义能否得到伸张。
• Her look was skeptical and resigned.她的表情是将信将疑而又无可奈何。

11 vigilant   

adj.警觉的，警戒的，警惕的

参考例句：

• He has to learn how to remain vigilant through these long nights.他得学会如何在这漫长的黑夜里保持警觉。
• The dog kept a vigilant guard over the house.这只狗警醒地守护着这所房屋。

12 chuckle   

vi.／n.轻声笑，咯咯笑

参考例句：

• He shook his head with a soft chuckle.他轻轻地笑着摇了摇头。
• I couldn't suppress a soft chuckle at the thought of it.想到这个，我忍不住轻轻地笑起来。