PBS高端访谈:今天的美国缺乏宗教信仰,并不仅限于千禧世代

 　　GWEN IFILL: Now to surprising new findings about our changing religious landscape, and how and if we believe.

　　Jeffrey Brown has our conversation.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: The U.S. remains¹ an overwhelmingly Christian² country. That hasn't changed, but a new survey shows a significant drop in the number of Americans who identify as Christian.

　　The survey was done by the Pew Research Center. It showed that, in 2007, 78 percent of Americans identified as Christian. By last year, the percentage had dropped to under 71 percent. Those years have seen a dramatic rise in the number of Americans who say they are religiously unaffiliated, from 16 to nearly 23 percent.

　　The largest drop was in mainline Protestant denominations⁴, but the number of Catholics also fell. Several non-Christian religions, Islam and Hinduism, saw modest gains.

　　Alan Cooperman is here. She's the director of religious research at Pew. Also with us is Reverend Serene⁶ Jones, president of the Union Theological Seminary in New York City.

　　And welcome to both of you.

　　And, Alan Cooperman, let me start with you.

　　One aspect of this that might surprise people is just how widespread this drop is. Did that strike you?

　　ALAN COOPERMAN, Pew Research Center: Absolutely, Jeff.

　　I mean, I think the important thing for people the realize is, this is really widespread, broad-based social change. It's taking place not just in the big cities or in the Northeast. It's taking place in every region of the country, including in the Bible Belt, among men and women, among blacks, Latinos and whites, among older people and younger people, and among people with college degrees and those with only high school degrees.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: And, Dr. Jones, what — does it jibe⁷ with what you see happening around you? Are you surprised at all?

　　REV⁵. SERENE JONES, President, Union Theological Seminary: Yes, it's surprising to see the statistics lay it out so clearly, but, on another level, it's not surprising at all. It's exactly what we all look around when what we see in New York City or — I'm from Oklahoma — when I walk through the fields of the small town I grew up in. It's the reality of the U.S. we live in today.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: Tell me a little bit more. What do you think explains it?

　　REV. SERENE JONES: Well, it's very interesting.

　　At Union Theological Seminary, we're seeing the unaffiliated, this now growing group, fastest growing group, actually walking through the doors of seminary. So I have occasion quite often to talk to them about why they have left religious communities and what it is about spirituality in general that seems to still attract them.

　　And I think one of the reasons why we're seeing the bigger drop in the mainline than we are in the evangelical, for instance, is that, in a lot of mainline communities, the line between what it means to be in the church and out of the church is a very fluid line. And we see the unaffiliated, you know, perhaps coming back to church once or twice a year, not quite sure what they think about religion, whereas, in evangelical communities, that demarcation is much sharper and the pressure not to leave the community is greater.

　　I think it's interesting in a mainline context to ask, what are the incentives⁸ to stay? And I think it's causing the mainline churches to do a lot of soul-searching, first of all, to figure out why people are leaving, but secondly⁹ to ask this really interesting question: Is it always bad that churches shrink? And those are sort of interesting political and theological questions that the survey doesn't touch upon, but I think we're being prompted to deal with.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: Let me ask Alan Cooperman about what the survey does touch on, the unaffiliated, this rise, because it too is fairly widespread, right? We have a graphic¹⁰ of age demographics. Tell us about that.

　　ALAN COOPERMAN: Well, it's especially concentrated among younger generations.

　　So, while it's true that it's taking place amongst older adults, as well as among younger adults, it's really startling. Among the youngest millennials, 36 percent are unaffiliated, whereas, in the country as a whole, it's down 23 percent. Among older generations, it's a much smaller percentage.

　　And so a lot of what's happening, Jeff, is what we call generational replacement¹¹. It's a nice way of saying that the older generations, which were very heavily Christian, are passing away, and they're being replaced by younger cohorts that are far more unaffiliated, not only than older generations are today, but than those older generations ever were.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: And let me stay with you, because this is another question that follows. Is this an affiliation¹² or denominational-type issue, or is it an issue of actual religious faith? How much do we know about that distinction?

　　ALAN COOPERMAN: Oh, these labels matter.

　　Now, of course, within every religious group, and within every group of people who identify themselves as Christians¹³, there is a spectrum¹⁴. There are people who are — who don't believe and there are people who are very strong believers. There are people who attend church regularly and people who seldom or never go. Within every group, there is a spectrum.

　　But, for sure, Jeff, those who are unaffiliated are much less likely to attend religious services. They pray less often. Religion is less important to them. And there are also political concomitants. For example, the unaffiliated as a whole lean almost as strongly Democratic as white evangelical Protestants lean Republican.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: Well, Serene Jones, you asked that question about how much this matters to particular churches and particular denominations. What do you — can you begin an answer here for us?

　　REV. SERENE JONES: Well, it's a challenge to all the denominations, the mainline in particular that I'm most familiar with at Union, to ask why this drift is happening.

　　But I think one of the biggest challenges when asking that question is to say, look, religion is not like going to — you know, it's not a campaign. It's not a sport event. It's not about numbers. It is, though, interesting to look at demographics and say, what do they tell us about the world in which these religious communities find themselves?

　　And one of the interesting things I'm seeing at Union — and the demographics in the new study bear this out — is the religiously unaffiliated are growing in numbers, but we're also seeing an uptake in the numbers of Pentecostal and charismatic black and brown Christians coming to seminary.

　　So at the two ends of the spectrum, we see growth, where in the middle we're seeing a flattening¹⁵ and at times a decline. So what does it mean that, at both of these that would appear to be different ends of the religious spectrum with expression — with relationship to the way they express their faith, are both sort of taking ahold of this younger generation?

　　JEFFREY BROWN: You know, Alan Cooperman, I want to ask you about a separate Pew study I saw slightly earlier, but it suggests that this U.S. path differs from the rest of the world. And other surveys suggested that the world is becoming more religiously affiliated³.

　　ALAN COOPERMAN: Yes, the United States is on a path that in some ways looks similar to what's happened in Western Europe, what's happened in other parts of the developing world, where secularization¹⁶ has been taking place, where the unaffiliated are growing.

　　But you're absolutely right. The fastest growing parts of the world, in terms of population, are places like sub-Saharan Africa, South Asia, and these are places where almost everybody identifies with a faith. And so they are somewhat contrary trends. On the one hand, the world population as a whole is over time becoming, if anything, more religiously affiliated, while Western Europe and the United States are becoming less.

　　And that does raise very interesting questions. Will we be able to understand each other in the future?

　　JEFFREY BROWN: And, very briefly¹⁷, do you expect what you see happening, the trends here in the U.S., to continue?

　　ALAN COOPERMAN: Well, on demographic grounds, yes.

　　Of course, there's a great deal that I don't pretend to be able to predict, but when we see the younger generations increasingly unaffiliated and even the younger millennials more unaffiliated than older millennials, I see no reason to think that this, at least in the immediate¹⁸ future, going to turn around. Fifty years from now, 100 years from now, I can't possibly know.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: We will talk then.

　　JEFFREY BROWN: Alan Cooperman and Dr. Serene Jones, thank you both very much.

　　ALAN COOPERMAN: Thank you, Jeff.

　　REV. SERENE JONES: Thank you.

1 remains   

n.剩余物，残留物；遗体，遗迹

参考例句：

• He ate the remains of food hungrily.他狼吞虎咽地吃剩余的食物。
• The remains of the meal were fed to the dog.残羹剩饭喂狗了。

2 Christian   

adj.基督教徒的；n.基督教徒

参考例句：

• They always addressed each other by their Christian name.他们总是以教名互相称呼。
• His mother is a sincere Christian.他母亲是个虔诚的基督教徒。

3 affiliated   

adj. 附属的, 有关连的

参考例句：

• The hospital is affiliated with the local university. 这家医院附属于当地大学。
• All affiliated members can vote. 所有隶属成员都有投票权。

4 denominations   

n.宗派( denomination的名词复数 )；教派；面额；名称

参考例句：

• Christians of all denominations attended the conference. 基督教所有教派的人都出席了这次会议。
• The service was attended by Christians of all denominations. 这次礼拜仪式各教派的基督徒都参加了。 来自《简明英汉词典》

5 rev   

v.发动机旋转，加快速度

参考例句：

• It's his job to rev up the audience before the show starts.他要负责在表演开始前鼓动观众的热情。
• Don't rev the engine so hard.别让发动机转得太快。

6 serene   

adj. 安详的，宁静的，平静的

参考例句：

• He has entered the serene autumn of his life.他已进入了美好的中年时期。
• He didn't speak much,he just smiled with that serene smile of his.他话不多，只是脸上露出他招牌式的淡定的微笑。

7 jibe   

v.嘲笑，与...一致，使转向；n.嘲笑，嘲弄

参考例句：

• Perhaps I should withdraw my jibe about hot air.或许我应当收回对热火朝天的嘲笑。
• What he says does not jibe with what others say.他所说的与其他人说的不一致。

8 incentives   

激励某人做某事的事物( incentive的名词复数 )； 刺激； 诱因； 动机

参考例句：

• tax incentives to encourage savings 鼓励储蓄的税收措施
• Furthermore, subsidies provide incentives only for investments in equipment. 更有甚者，提供津贴仅是为鼓励增添设备的投资。 来自英汉非文学 - 环境法 - 环境法

9 secondly   

adv.第二，其次

参考例句：

• Secondly,use your own head and present your point of view.第二，动脑筋提出自己的见解。
• Secondly it is necessary to define the applied load.其次，需要确定所作用的载荷。

10 graphic   

adj.生动的，形象的，绘画的，文字的，图表的

参考例句：

• The book gave a graphic description of the war.这本书生动地描述了战争的情况。
• Distinguish important text items in lists with graphic icons.用图标来区分重要的文本项。

11 replacement   

n.取代，替换，交换；替代品，代用品

参考例句：

• We are hard put to find a replacement for our assistant.我们很难找到一个人来代替我们的助手。
• They put all the students through the replacement examination.他们让所有的学生参加分班考试。

12 affiliation   

n.联系，联合

参考例句：

• There is no affiliation between our organization and theirs,even though our names are similar.尽管两个组织的名称相似，但我们之间并没有关系。
• The kidnappers had no affiliation with any militant group.这些绑架者与任何军事组织都没有紧密联系。

13 Christians   

n.基督教徒( Christian的名词复数 )

参考例句：

• Christians of all denominations attended the conference. 基督教所有教派的人都出席了这次会议。
• His novel about Jesus caused a furore among Christians. 他关于耶稣的小说激起了基督教徒的公愤。

14 spectrum   

n.谱，光谱，频谱；范围，幅度，系列

参考例句：

• This is a kind of atomic spectrum.这是一种原子光谱。
• We have known much of the constitution of the solar spectrum.关于太阳光谱的构成，我们已了解不少。

15 flattening   

n. 修平 动词flatten的现在分词

参考例句：

• Flattening of the right atrial border is also seen in constrictive pericarditis. 右心房缘变平亦见于缩窄性心包炎。
• He busied his fingers with flattening the leaves of the book. 他手指忙着抚平书页。

16 secularization   

n.凡俗化，还俗，把教育从宗教中分离

参考例句：

• But secularization of modernity society made the two prerequisites impossibility. 然而现代社会的世俗化使得这两个前提不复存在。 来自互联网
• So heart will be also inadvertently been secularization of. 以至于心也在不经意间被俗化了。 来自互联网

17 briefly   

adv.简单地，简短地

参考例句：

• I want to touch briefly on another aspect of the problem.我想简单地谈一下这个问题的另一方面。
• He was kidnapped and briefly detained by a terrorist group.他被一个恐怖组织绑架并短暂拘禁。

18 immediate   

adj.立即的；直接的，最接近的；紧靠的

参考例句：

• His immediate neighbours felt it their duty to call.他的近邻认为他们有责任去拜访。
• We declared ourselves for the immediate convocation of the meeting.我们主张立即召开这个会议。