PBS高端访谈:中美洲的"大篷车移民"（在线收听）

JUDY WOODRUFF: We turn now to the group of migrants seeking political asylum in the U.S. This is the so-called caravan from Central America. John Yang has our update.

JOHN YANG: Judy, tonight, more than 100 Central American migrants remain steps from the U.S. border in Tijuana, Mexico. Some of them celebrated when told that, overnight, U.S. officials admitted eight of them to an immigration checkpoint to apply for asylum, spurring hopes that more will be allowed to follow. Separately, the Justice Department charged 11 people believed to have been part of the group with entering the country illegally. For the latest, we're joined by NPR's Carrie Kahn, who is back in Mexico City after leaving Tijuana this morning. Carrie, thanks for joining us. What's the latest on this group of people, and how many are being allowed into the United States to apply for asylum?

CARRIE KAHN, NPR: As you said, there were eight last night. And at about noon local time in Tijuana, they let in about six more. So it's a trickle of asylum claimants that they're allowing into the port of entry right there.

JOHN YANG: So, Carrie, what are the conditions you saw in Tijuana before you left this morning?

CARRIE KAHN: So, you have the 140-some from the caravan, migrants, mothers, children, setting up, laying on blanks on the concrete with tarps and tents. But what also happened was, word got out that the Central Americans were there, and these migrants also started showing up, and they were very upset, because they had been in Tijuana for more than a week waiting. They said they had an informal list, so that it would go in order who would be able to walk into the U.S. facility asked for asylum. I said, how many people are on this list? And the man told me there were 300, twice as many of the Central Americans. And they began starting to form tents and tarps there. So you have this huge encampment of 450 some claimants that are waiting to get into the U.S. to ask for political asylum. It is an incredibly dire scene there at the border. One woman that I spoke to, her 15-year-old daughter was kidnapped by gang members and held for days and was gang-raped. And as soon as she was able to secure her release, she fled her home with that daughter and another daughter. Another woman that I have talked to, she showed me scars on her child's head that she said was beaten consciously in retaliation for her husband's actions with gang members. It's just some horrific violence that we hear about.

JOHN YANG: And this trickle, as you put it, that were being allowed in to begin the process of asking for asylum in the United States, what's the process that they face now?

CARRIE KAHN: The first point that they have to do is, they have to tell -- the first immigration officer that they see, they have to tell them that they have a credible fear. And it's up to that officer to decide whether he believes that they have a credible fear. And if they do, then they begin the asylum process. That could be being in detention for an indeterminate amount of time, or it's up to the officers and the administration at the time whether they want to allow them to be released. They can be released to family member or a sponsor, sometimes with a monitoring apparatus around their ankle, or they will be kept in detention throughout the entire process. That's another discretion that we will have to see what the Trump administration is doing with these particular asylum claimants.

JOHN YANG: And, of course, President Trump had been saying that no one would be allowed in. They are allowing this trickle, as you say. And, on the other hand, they have arrested 11 and charged them with entering the country illegally. What message do you think the administration is sending to this group?

CARRIE KAHN: They have singled out these 11, and they're definitely trying to send a message back to the members of the caravan and migrants trying to cross illegally that they will be prosecuted under the full extent of the law.

JOHN YANG: Carrie Kahn of NPR, thanks so much for joining us.

CARRIE KAHN: You're welcome.

朱迪·伍德拉夫：现在我们来谈谈在美国寻求政治庇护的移民群体。这就是所谓中美洲“大篷车移民”。约翰·杨为我们带来最新消息。

约翰·杨：朱蒂，今晚，超过100名中美洲移民滞留在位于墨西哥蒂华纳的美墨边境。当他们获知，他们中的8人一夜之间获得美国官员批准，到移民检查站申请庇护时，有些人不由庆祝起来，这也为他们带来了更多希望。另外，司法部对11人提出了非法入境指控，司法部相信他们也是这群人中成员。NPR的卡丽·卡恩今早离开蒂华纳，返回墨西哥城，现在让我们连线卡丽，为我们带来最新消息。卡丽，感谢加入。这些人的最新动态如何？有多少人已经获准，进入美国申请庇护？

卡丽·卡恩，NPR：正如你所说，昨晚有8个。蒂华纳当地时间中午，又有6人获得批准。所以这些移民只是涓涓细流，他们只是一小批获准进入美国的。

约翰·杨：那么，卡丽，你今天早上离开蒂华纳前，情况如何？

卡丽·卡恩：那么，他们的“大篷车”约有140人，移民，母亲，孩子，他们在混凝土地面上，铺上油毡，搭起帐篷，席地而卧，就此驻扎。中美洲人到来的消息不胫而走，移民随即多了起来，他们非常沮丧，因为他们已经在蒂华纳苦等了一个多星期。他们说他们有一张非正式的名单，以便他们可以据此，依次到美国移民检查站申请庇护。我说，这张名单上有多少人？这个人告诉我，有300人，这些移民是中美洲移民的两倍。然后他们开始在那里搭建帐篷，铺上油毡。所以这个庞大的阵营约有450人，他们正等待进入美国寻求政治庇护。由此边境形成了一个骇人场面。一个女人对我说，她15岁的女儿遭遇团伙绑架，长达数日，遭到轮奸。她的女儿刚一得到释放，她就和她及另一个女儿一起离家出逃。还有一个女人，她让我看了那个在她孩子头上的疤痕，她说，因一伙歹徒要对她的丈夫实行报复，因此她还没意识过来，就遭到了殴打。这只是我们听到的一些可怕的暴力事件。

约翰·杨：正如你所说的，获准进入美国寻求庇护的过程如同涓涓细流，那么他们现在所面临的寻求庇护的流程是怎样的？

卡丽·卡恩：他们首先必须做到，他们必须告诉他们遇到的第一个移民官员，他们必须告诉他们，他们的恐惧确凿无疑。这取决于那个官员是否相信他们确有恐惧。如果他们相信，那么庇护流程才能启动。他们可能遭到拘留，而且时间未卜，或者取决于当时的官员和政府是否允许他们获释。家庭或赞助商可能收留他们，有时还会在他们脚踝处安装一个监控装置，或者整个过程中他们将始终处于拘留状态。这又是自由裁量，我们必须了解特朗普政府对这些特殊庇护申请者的做法。

约翰·杨：当然，特朗普总统一直在说任何人不准入境。正如你们所说的，他们允许这种涓涓细流。另一方面，他们逮捕了11人，并指控他们非法入境。你认为政府的做法给这些人传递了什么样的讯息？

卡丽·卡恩：他们已经挑出了这11个人，而且他们确实试图把讯息传递给这一群体，这群试图非法入境的移民，他们将在法律的全部范围内遭到起诉。

约翰·杨：NPR的卡丽·卡恩，非常感谢你的加入。

卡丽·卡恩：不客气。