PBS高端访谈:美参议院通过赈灾拨款法案（在线收听）

JUDY WOODRUFF: After a holdup that lasted for months, the U.S. Senate has overwhelmingly passed a funding bill to help communities hit by natural disasters. The vote was 85-8. The House is expected to quickly follow suit, and the president said today that he will sign it. The NewsHour's White House correspondent, Yamiche Alcindor, has been tracking the debate, and she joins me now. So, Yamiche, you have been following this. There's a lot in this bill. Give us a sense of what it is.

YAMICHE ALCINDOR: Well, this is a required bipartisan bill aimed at impacting areas and helping areas impact by natural disasters. So, to walk you through it, there's $19.1 billion in disaster relief. Now, that's for parts of the United States hit by hurricanes, flooding, earthquakes, and wildfires. That money will go to places in the Southeast, Midwest, California, as well as some parts of the military for damaged bases. There's also $1.4 billion for Puerto Rico. Now, that's to help with the recovery from Hurricane Maria that hit the island in 2017. That was also a big sticking point for President Trump, who was against giving all this money to Puerto Rico. And it excludes the $4.5 billion for funding for the U.S.-Mexico border. That's another concession by President Trump, because he said he wanted to get immigration money in this bill. Today, of course, he said he was told that he's going to be able to get that immigration money in a separate bill. On timing, our Lisa Desjardins, of course, our Capitol Hill correspondent. She says that lawmakers think it's possible that this bill could be sent to the president as early as tomorrow afternoon.

JUDY WOODRUFF: So, just yesterday, Yamiche, as you know, the president was saying that he wouldn't work with Democrats on anything as long as the House continues to investigate him. The war of words between the president and Speaker Pelosi escalated today.

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): Now, this time, another temper tantrum. Again, I pray for the president of the United States. I wish that his family or his administration or his staff would have an intervention for the good of the country. The White House is just crying out for impeachment. That's why he flipped yesterday.

DONALD TRUMP, President of the United States: She said I walked into the room right next door yesterday, and walked in and started screaming and yelling. Just the opposite. Just the opposite. Crazy Nancy, I tell you what. I have been watching her, and I have been watching her for a long period of time. She's not the same person. She's lost it.

JUDY WOODRUFF: So, a remarkable war of words, Yamiche. I mean, we have seen it before. This brings it to a new level. What does this mean?

YAMICHE ALCINDOR: Well, the attacks between President Trump and congressional Democrats just keep getting more and more personal. This disaster relief bill was done largely on Capitol Hill behind closed doors, with lawmakers on the Hill being able to talk to each other, the president making concessions. But when you go to the president and the Democrats, they are just at odds, and it's just getting worse and worse. The president is now, of course, using insults and is really going after Democrats, saying that they're bitter about 2016, that they really just want to impeach him. On the Democratic side, they are saying that he's acting unpresidential and that he's really not fit for the office. So the sources inside the White House and on Capitol Hill tell me this really just means that the gridlock in Washington could just get worse, which is, of course, in some ways unimaginable. But this is really going to be holding up all sorts of bills, including immigration, infrastructure, already long shots, but things are going to just get harder.

JUDY WOODRUFF: It has gotten very personal. Yamiche Alcindor, we thank you.

YAMICHE ALCINDOR: Thanks.

朱迪·伍德拉夫：在搁置了数月之后，美国参议院高票通过了一项拨款法案，以帮助受到自然灾害重创的诸多社群。通过的票比是85-8。众议院预计很快也会就此事举行投票。特朗普总统今天称自己会签署该法案。我台驻白宫记者阿尔辛多一直在跟进该议题的讨论。现在，我们已与他连线。阿尔辛多，你一直在跟进这件事，这项法案里涉及到很多内容，可以否为我们做一些介绍？

阿尔辛多：这是两党共同提出的法案，针对的是受灾地区和受到波及的地区。详细介绍一下：救灾资金有191亿美元。这笔资金用于支援受到飓风、洪灾、地震、大火侵袭的美国地区。这笔资金将送往美国东南部、中西部、加州以及受损地区的部分军队。此外还有14亿资金是支援波多黎各的。这笔资金旨在支援2017年受到飓风玛利亚侵袭的地区实现灾后重建。这笔资金也是特朗普如鲠在喉的存在，因为特朗普反对将这笔资金捐赠给波多黎各。而且其中不包含建造美墨边境墙所需的45亿美元。这是特朗普总统的又一让步，因为特朗普曾表示自己希望在法案中获得用于移民事宜的资金。当然了，今天，特朗普表示自己听说能在另一项议案中获得这笔移民资金。这时候就一定要提到我们另一位驻国会大厦的记者丽莎·德雅尔丹。她说很多译员认为有可能这项议案会在明天下午就发给特朗普总统。

朱迪·伍德拉夫：那么，就在昨天的时候，阿尔辛多，你也知道，特朗普总统昨天说自己不会跟民主党有任何合作，除非众议院能停止对他的调查。特朗普跟众议院议长佩洛西之间的唇枪舌战在今天又进一步升级了。

众议员南希·佩洛西：现在，特朗普又发脾气了。我再次为这位美国总统祈祷。我希望他的家人、他的政府和他的公务员能介入此事，这是为了我们国家好。白宫正在呼吁弹劾特朗普。这也是他今天勃然大怒的原因。

唐纳德·特朗普，美国总统：她说我走进屋子就开始大吼大叫。但事实截然相反，根本不是她说的那样。疯狂的南希，你听清楚咯。我一直注视着她，我注视她很长的时间。她不再是以前的南希，她失去了从前的人格。

朱迪·伍德拉夫：阿尔辛多，真如你所说，是唇枪舌战啊。我们以前见过这阵仗，但这一次又上升到了新高度。这一次意味着什么呢？

阿尔辛多：特朗普和国会民主党之间的互相攻击一直上升到个人。这次救灾的议案基本是国会闭门会议敲定的，国会议员们彼此交流，总统做出了许多让步。但每次一到特朗普和民主党议员的时候，他们就会发生争执，情况愈演愈烈。当然了，特朗普正在对许多民主党议员进行人身攻击，抓住他们不放。特朗普说这些民主党议员吃了柠檬，嫉妒他2016年当选总统，他们只为这个原因就想弹劾他。而在民主党一边，他们却认为，特朗普的行为不像个总统的样子，他不适合总统的职位。白宫和国会的一些知情人士表示，这只表明美国政府的僵局会每况愈下，达到难以想象的程度。这只会让各种议案的审批遭到搁置，包括与移民、基础设施还有一些远期的计划在内，都会更难实行。

朱迪·伍德拉夫：现在攻击已经愈发上升到个人了。谢谢你发回的报道，阿尔辛多。

阿尔辛多：谢谢。