美国国家公共电台 NPR 拜登发表讲话驳斥特朗普 称其制造混乱和分裂（在线收听）

Joe Biden says he is the candidate of safety and security while President Trump sows chaos and division.

乔·拜登表示，他是保障安全的候选人，而特朗普总统在制造混乱和分裂。

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JOE BIDEN: He can't stop the violence because for years, he's fomented it.

乔·拜登：他无法阻止暴力，因为多年来他一直在煽动暴力。

KELLY: Biden spoke today amid ongoing protests and some instances of deadly violence in Kenosha, Wis., and Portland, Ore. Biden was in Pittsburgh today, which means so was NPR political correspondent Asma Khalid.

凯利：拜登今天发表了讲话，此时威斯康星州基诺沙市和俄勒冈州波特兰市的抗议和致命暴力事件正在不断升级。拜登今天在匹兹堡发表讲话，NPR新闻的政治记者阿斯玛·哈利德也在那里。

Hey, Asma.

你好，阿斯玛。

ASMA KHALID, BYLINE: Hi there.

阿斯玛·哈利德连线：你好。

KELLY: Lay out what the main message was today from Joe Biden.

凯利：请介绍一下乔·拜登今天传达的主要信息。

KHALID: Well, Mary Louise, really, Joe Biden tried to flip the GOP campaign script on its head. A key thrust of the Republican convention last week was that voters will not be safe in Donald Trump's America, and Joe Biden today was rejecting some of the Trump campaign's caricatures of him.

哈利德：玛丽·路易斯，乔·拜登试图颠覆共和党的竞选脚本。上周共和党全国代表大会的其中一个重点是，选民在乔·拜登领导下的美国不会安全，今天拜登驳斥了特朗阵营对他的讽刺。

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BIDEN: You know me. You know my heart. You know my story, my family's story. Ask yourself, do I look like a radical socialist with a soft spot for rioters? Really?

拜登：你们了解我。你们知道我的心思。你们清楚我的事情，也知道我家人的情况。扪心自问，我看起来像激进的社会主义者，还对暴乱者有好感吗？真是这样吗？

KHALID: You know, Biden delivered a fairly forceful argument that was clearly directed at moderate swing voters that really, in his view, voters are not safe currently in Donald Trump's America. He emphasized multiple times that the violence that's happening right now in places like Kenosha, Wis., is happening on Donald Trump's watch.

哈利德：拜登提出了相当有力的论点，这明显针对的是温和派摇摆选民，在他看来，目前选民在唐纳德·特朗普领导下的美国并不安全。他多次强调，现在威斯康星州基诺沙市等地爆发的暴力事件是在唐纳德·特朗普执政期间发生的。

KELLY: You know, it's interesting, Asma, because the Trump campaign has criticized Biden for not speaking up, not speaking out about looting, about rioting. It sounds like he did exactly that today.

凯利：这值得关注，阿斯玛，特朗普竞选团队指责拜登不表态，不谈论抢劫和骚乱。听起来他今天明确谈及了这些问题。

KHALID: He did, exactly, right? And I know the Trump campaign, even after this speech, had the same criticism, but it's just factually not true. Here Biden is clearly addressing looting in some of his remarks today.

哈利德：他确实有谈到，对吧？据我了解，在拜登这场讲话之后，特朗普竞选团队依然提出了同样的批评，但这并不是事实。拜登在今天的讲话中明确提及了抢劫，我们来听一下。

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BIDEN: I want to be very clear about all of this. Rioting is not protesting. Looting is not protesting. Setting fires is not protesting. None of this is protesting. It's lawlessness, plain and simple.

拜登：我想明确说明一下。暴乱不是抗议。抢劫不是抗议。纵火也不是抗议。这些全都不是抗议。简单来说，这些是目无法纪的行为。

KHALID: And I should point out that President Trump — he tweeted about this speech also again saying that Joe Biden is blaming the police far more than he's blaming the rioters and the looters, et cetera. But again, as we just heard, that just doesn't, you know, factually hold up with the remarks that we heard from Joe Biden. It seems to be though that, Mary Louise, the Trump campaign thinks that this is good, safe terrain for them. This law and order message that the president's been trying to highlight, they feel, will work particularly well with white suburban voters. And the president plans on going to Kenosha, Wis., himself tomorrow. I should add that Joe Biden says he hopes he'll be able to go to Wisconsin now as well, though we don't have a clear sense of when and if that might happen.

哈利德：我要指出的是，特朗普总统在推特上谈及这场讲话时再次表示，乔·拜登对警方的指责要远多于他对暴乱者和抢劫者的指责。但正如我们刚才所听到的，这同样与拜登的言论不符。不过，玛丽·路易斯，特朗普竞选团队似乎认为这对他们来说是有利且安全的形势。他们认为，总统不断强调的法律与秩序信息将尤为适用于白人郊区选民。总统计划明天亲自前往威斯康星州基诺沙市。我要补充一下，乔·拜登表示他希望现在也能去威斯康星州，不过目前我们尚不清楚具体时间，也不清楚这一计划能否成型。

KELLY: To follow on your point that the Trump campaign thinks this is good terrain, safe terrain for them politically, do we know how the Democrats feel about this? Is it good terrain, safe terrain for them that the presidential race, at the moment at least, is so centered on these issues?

凯利：你刚提到特朗普竞选团队认为，从政治上来说这对他们是有利且安全的形势，那民主党对此有何看法？至少目前来看，总统竞选在围绕这些问题展开，那对民主党来说也是有利且安全的形势吗？

KHALID: You know, there has been some hand-wringing among Democrats that this is a message — the president's message and the president's spin on law and order could cost them in places like Wisconsin. You know, Kenosha was an extremely tight county in the 2016 election that did go for the president, and so they are worried about, you know, a battleground state. But I will say there's really no solid polling on this. What I think was interesting to me today was that Joe Biden seemed to have flipped the switch and focused more broadly about safety and security, not just about law and order but focusing on COVID, focusing on Social Security, the economy and make this a broader message of how safe Americans feel, how secure they feel currently in Donald Trump's America.

哈利德：有些民主党人担心，总统传递的信息以及其对法律与秩序的陈述可能会让他们在威斯康星州这样的地方付出代价。在2016年总统大选时，基诺沙市的选情非常紧张，当时总统赢下了该市，因此民主党人对这个战场州感到担心。我要指出，目前这方面没有可靠的民意调查。在我看来今天值得注意的情况是，乔·拜登似乎触动了开关，更广泛地关注安全和保障，不仅仅是法律与秩序，他还聚焦了新冠肺炎、社会保障制度和经济，并扩大这些问题的范围，引出美国人在唐纳德·特朗普的领导下所感受到的安全和保障程度。

KELLY: All right. That is NPR's Asma Khalid reporting today from Pittsburgh.

凯利：好。以上是NPR新闻的阿斯玛·哈利德从匹兹堡带来的报道。

Thank you, Asma.

谢谢你，阿斯玛。

KHALID: You're welcome.

哈利德：不客气。