PBS高端访谈:有关美国大选的假新闻（在线收听）

JUDY WOODRUFF: Let's dive deeper into concerns around spreading misinformation, its consequences, and securing our votes. Some of the most pointed attacks during today's Senate hearing included examples of how the leading social media platforms have been used to spread misinformation. William Brangham explores just how that misinformation can be transmitted easily by American voters and influence thinking. Afterwards, he has an interview with one of the top officials from the Department of Homeland Security.

朱迪·伍德乐夫：我们将更深入探讨有关传播错误信息、其后果以及确保民众选票的担忧。今天的参议院听证会上作出了一些攻击，其中最为尖锐的包括对被用来传播错误信息的大型社交媒体平台的攻击。威廉·布兰加姆探究了这种错误信息轻易被美国选民传递并影响民众思维的原因。之后，他对国土安全部一位高级官员进行了采访。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: Have you heard that voter fraud is rampant in the U.S.? Well, it isn't. Or that Bill Gates is going to microchip Americans using the COVID-19 vaccine? That's also false. Or that President Trump didn't really have the coronavirus? Wrong. He did. None of these are true, but they have been read and spread by millions, and they represent just drops in a vast ocean of misinformation.

威廉·布兰加姆：选举舞弊很猖獗，你听说了吗？不，这是假的。又或者比尔·盖茨会给使用COVID-19疫苗的美国人植入微芯片？这也是假的。再或者特朗普总统真的没有感染冠状病毒？不对，他真的感染了。这些信息都是错误的，但是这些信息已经被上百万人阅读和传播，它们只是错误信息海洋中的一滴水。

WOMAN: Good morning, everybody. Have a busy day.

女士：大家早上好，今天真是忙碌的一天。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: It's become such a pervasive problem that a small industry of fact-checkers, like the people here at PolitiFact, is working overtime to debunk them.

威廉·布兰加姆：假信息的传播已经如此普遍，以致于像“政治事实”这样专门审核信息真伪的小行业的工作人员不得不加班加点地揭穿它们。

WOMAN: Amy has a good fact-check on whether Biden is a socialist or supports socialist policies.

女士：艾米对“拜登是社会主义者还是支持社会主义政策”这条新闻进行了很好的核查，威廉。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: All the major social media platforms are trying to flag false or misleading claims posted on their sites. There are online courses teaching citizens how to distinguish truth from fiction.

布兰加姆：所有大型社交媒体平台都在试图标示其网站上发布的虚假或误导性言论，甚至出现了教公民如何辨别真伪的网络课程。

WOMAN: And try to think what your inherent biases or lenses might be that are causing you to see news in a certain way.

女士：试着想一下，是什么固有的偏见或视角导致你以某种方式看待新闻。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: We sat in on one for senior citizens run by a group called Senior Planet.

威廉·布兰加姆：我们旁听了一个叫做“老年星球”的组织举办的老年人聚会。

WOMAN: So, it really impacts everybody when people disseminate fake news.

女士：所以，当人们传播假新闻时，它真的在影响每一个人。

DANNAGAL YOUNG, University of Delaware: The people who are susceptible to misinformation includes anyone who has a preexisting opinion about anything, so anyone.

丹娜格尔·杨，特拉华大学：容易受到假信息影响的人也包括那些对任何事情都有先入之见的人，所以任何人都会被误导。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: Dannagal Young of the University of Delaware studies misinformation. She says the pandemic has only made it worse.

威廉·布兰加姆：特拉华大学的丹娜格尔·杨对假信息进行了研究，她说新冠只会使情况变得更糟。

DANNAGAL YOUNG: When you think about this in terms of evolutionary psychology, we are hard-wired for survival, especially when we are under conditions that mimic fear and threat. So, you know if you are encountering a tiger in the jungle or something, you're not going to do a slow pro/con list of the different courses of action that you might take. Instead, you're actually just going to make a decision quickly based on emotions and intuition. And the person who writes the pro/con list will be eaten by the tiger.

丹娜格尔·杨：如果你从进化心理学的角度来思考这个问题，我们天生就有生存的本能，尤其是当我们处在模拟恐惧和威胁的环境中时。所以，你知道，如果你在丛林中遇到一只老虎或其他什么，你不会对你可能采取的不同行动方案做一个缓慢的赞成或反对清单。相反，你实际上只是基于情绪和直觉迅速做出决定，而写赞成或反对清单的人会被老虎吃掉。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: Do you suspect that there's some foul play going on there? On the issue of the pandemic, retired veteran Kell Bales from Wisconsin has real questions about whether the official coronavirus death toll is accurate.

威廉·布兰加姆：你怀疑那里在上演犯规事件吗？在新冠的问题上，来自威斯康辛州的退休老兵凯尔·贝尔斯对官方报道的新冠病毒的死亡人数表示怀疑。

KELL BALES, Wisconsin: I feel strongly that there's a lot of political motivation behind a lot of these kind of numbers being pushed out there.

凯尔·贝尔斯，威斯康辛州：我有很强的直觉，这个巨大的数字背后绝对有很多政治动机。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: Bales is an ordained pastor and a supporter of President Trump. In his media ecosystem, which is largely conservative voices, anything but a Trump win would be evidence of foul play.

威廉·布兰加姆：贝尔斯是一名圣职牧师，也是特朗普总统的支持者。在特朗普的媒体生态系统(基本上都是保守派的声音)中，除了特朗普获胜以外，任何事情都将是犯规行为的证据。

KELL BALES: If Biden were to win the presidency, seems to be clear, pretty clear evidence of fraud. We're all skewed, right My particular Facebook feed is--it's blown up with conservative, with like-minded individuals. We're all going to do that. We're going to surround ourselves with circles of like believers, like thinkers.

凯尔·贝尔斯：如果拜登赢得总统大选，那这里面肯定有耍手段的证据。我们都是偏执狂，对吧？我在脸书上的动态是——它被保守派和志同道合的人放大了，我们都会这样做，我们将被一群信仰者和思考者包围。

ARLENE LEHEW, Florida: I don't listen to any regular TV news, because it's not telling everything out there.

阿琳·勒休，佛罗里达州：我不会听任何常见的电视新闻，因为它们不会告诉你背后隐藏的真相。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: Arlene Lehew lives in The Villages, in Florida. It's a large retirement community. She's a grandmother and enjoys riding motorcycles.

威廉·布兰加姆：阿琳·勒休住在佛罗里达的村庄里，那是一个很大的退休社区。她是一位祖母，喜欢骑摩托车。

ARLENE LEHEW: I go online to Newsmax, Parler. I follow Dan Bongino.

阿琳·勒休：我会在Newsmax、Parler上看新闻。我关注了丹·邦吉诺。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: So those are all fairly, what people would argue are conservative news sites, or from a right perspective.

威廉·布兰格姆：所以这些网站是公正的，人们会认为它们是保守的新闻网站，或者是从正确的角度来评论的网站。

ARLENE LEHEW: Yes, I don't agree with that. I just feel it's truthful. I don't--I don't know if it's conservative or not. I think people that are on the Democratic side--and I used to be a Democrat. So, people that are on the Democratic side don't really want to hear the truth sometimes.

阿琳·勒休：嗯，我不同意这个说法，我只是觉得它们讲的是真的，我不知道它们是不是保守的。我觉得那些站在民主党一边的人——我曾经是一个民主党人。所以，支持民主党的人有时候并不想听到真相。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: Misinformation is nothing new, of course. Abe Lincoln back there, as with every other president, has been tarred with all sorts of lies and untruths. The difference is, is that, back then, the misinformation could only travel as fast as the railroads could take it. Nowadays, all you need is a few seconds, and this, and it's everywhere. Kell Bales shares posts to his Facebook page, like this video of President Trump falsely alleging that there's widespread fraud with mail-in ballots.

威廉·布兰加姆：当然，假信息并不是什么新鲜事。和其他总统一样，林肯也被各种各样的谎言所玷污。不同的是，那个时候假信息只能以铁路所能承载的速度传播。然而现在，信息传播只需几秒钟的时间，所以假信息无处不在。凯尔·贝尔斯在他的脸书页面上分享了这段视频，视频中特朗普总统错误地宣称邮寄选票存在广泛的欺诈行为。

DONALD TRUMP, President of the United States: This election will be the most rigged election in history.

唐纳德·特朗普，美国总统：这次选举将是历史上最受操纵的一次选举。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: When you look at all these organizations that say that there might be incredibly rare instances of people casting votes illegally, but it's 0.00000-something percent of votes cast, that doesn't give you any comfort

威廉·布兰加姆：当你看到所有这些组织说非法投票的情况可能非常罕见，但这是百分之0.00000的选票，这有没有给你一些安慰？

KELL BALES: Again, if we look at the numbers, if that's truly the number out there--I will have to, again, do my own research--I mean, I'm sure there are independent organizations out there doing the research. And that's great. I applaud them for it. But, ultimately, again, it's that--my personal gut-check.

凯尔·贝尔斯：我们再看看这个数字，如果这个数字是真的，我将不得不，再次，做我自己的研究，我的意思是，我相信有独立的组织在做这些研究。它们很棒，我为它们鼓掌。但是归根结底这是我个人的勇气。

ARLENE LEHEW: They found a lot of ballots like in the ocean and trunks and garbage cans. Dead people are getting ballots. Animals are getting ballots. My friend got one from a dog down the street. His dog's name is Charlie. He got a ballot.

阿琳·勒休：他们在海里、大箱子和垃圾桶里发现了很多选票，死人也拿到了选票，动物也拿到了选票，我的一个朋友从大街上的一只狗那里拿到一张选票，他的狗叫查理，查理也有一张选票。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: His dog was mailed a ballot

威廉·布兰加姆：他的狗收到了一张选票？

ARLENE LEHEW: Yes. Well, his name's Charlie, the dog. So, it was Charlie whatever their last name is, and he got a ballot.

阿琳·勒休：是的，那只狗叫查理。所以只要姓查理，不管你的名字是什么都能拿到选票。

WILLIAM BRANGHAM: It may sound preposterous. And, of course, pets can't vote. But, often, misinformation starts with a kernel of truth. One voting group did mistakenly mail a registration form to a deceased cat in Atlanta. But Dannagal Young says fact-checking alone isn't likely to address this ocean of misinformation.

威廉·布兰加姆：听起来可能很荒谬，当然，宠物是不能投票的。但是，假信息往往始于真相的核心。在亚特兰大，有一个投票小组把登记表错寄给了一只死去的猫。但丹那加尔·杨说，单靠事实核查不太可能解决这么多的假信息。

DANNAGAL YOUNG: If you can connect on the very needs and desires that are driving people to hold these beliefs in the first place, right, create those connections, that's where we create an inroad. It's hard, because we're asking you to have empathy for individuals who might be holding beliefs that could undermine your own freedom or undermine certain aspects of social justice. But this--if the goal is to correct misperceptions and--then those relationships have to come first.

丹那加尔·杨：如果你能将驱使人们持有这些信念的需求和欲望联系起来，那么就能建立这些联系，我们就能从这里取得进展。这很难，因为我们要求你对那些持有可能会破坏你的自由或社会公正的信念的人保持同理心。但是，如果目标是纠正误解，那么就必须首先考虑这些关系。