美国国家公共电台 NPR 美司法部长巴尔称未找到选举舞弊证据（在线收听）

It's been almost a month since Election Day. And today Attorney General William Barr weighed in on the integrity of the vote. Barr said in an interview with the Associated Press that the Justice Department has found no evidence of fraud that would change the outcome of the election. That is a message that directly contradicts President Trump's baseless claims of election fraud. NPR justice correspondent Ryan Lucas is here.

现在距离选举日已过去近一个月的时间。美国司法部长威廉·巴尔今天就投票的公正性发表了看法。巴尔在接受美联社采访时表示，司法部没有发现任何会改变选举结果的舞弊证据。这一表态与特朗普总统有关选举舞弊的毫无根据的说法完全矛盾。NPR新闻的司法记者瑞安·卢卡斯将带来详细报道。

Hey, Ryan.

你好，瑞安。

RYAN LUCAS, BYLINE: Hello there.

瑞安·卢卡斯连线：你好。

KELLY: So that's quite something — the attorney general directly contradicting his boss. What else did Barr say?

凯利：这相当重要，司法部长直接反驳了其领导。巴尔还说了什么？

LUCAS: So Barr told the Associated Press that federal prosecutors and the FBI had looked into specific allegations and information regarding the integrity of the vote. And he said quite bluntly they have not found any evidence of widespread fraud. The AP quotes Barr as saying, quote, "to date, we have not seen fraud on a scale that could have affected a different outcome in the election." In particular, Barr mentioned one claim made by the president's supporters that voting machines were programmed somehow to skew the results. Barr said the Justice Department and the Department of Homeland Security looked into those allegations and said they had not found anything to substantiate them.

卢卡斯：巴尔告诉美联社，联邦检察官和联邦调查局已经调查了有关投票公正性的具体指控和信息。他直言不讳地表示，他们还没有发现任何证明存在广泛欺诈行为的证据。美联社援引巴尔的话称，“到目前为止，我们还没有看到可能影响大选结果的大规模舞弊行为。”巴尔特别提到了总统支持者的一个说法，即投票机被设计成以某种方式扭曲了选举结果。巴尔说，司法部和国土安全部调查了这些指控，但没有找到任何证据来证实这些指控。

KELLY: Which is striking coming from Barr — he has been such a close ally of the president.

凯利：巴尔的话令人吃惊，毕竟他是总统的亲密盟友。

LUCAS: It really is striking. Barr is directly contradicting the president's repeated claims and, we should say, baseless claims that the election was stolen. And it's all the more striking because in the run up to the election, Barr was right alongside Trump, pushing unsubstantiated claims that mail-in voting was ripe for abuse and ripe for fraud. Barr repeatedly said such things publicly.

卢卡斯：相当惊人。巴尔直接反驳了总统反复提出的主张，我们应该指出，总统的主张毫无根据，总统一直称“选举结果被窃取了”。更令人震惊的是，在大选前，巴尔一直支持特朗普，而且提出了毫无根据的说法，即邮寄投票可能导致滥用和舞弊。巴尔多次在公开场合说过这样的话。

KELLY: I remember.

凯利：我记得。

LUCAS: And now here he is saying that the Justice Department, the FBI, has found no evidence of widespread fraud in this election.

卢卡斯：而现在他表示，司法部和联邦调查局没有发现在这次选举中存在大规模舞弊的证据。

KELLY: Any response from the president or his campaign?

凯利：总统或其竞选团队有何反应？

LUCAS: The president's lawyers, Rudy Giuliani and Jenna Ellis, put out a statement immediately in response to Barr's remarks. They allege the Justice Department hasn't really investigated anything here. And they say that they will continue their legal fight through the court, through courts, through state legislatures. But it has to be said. Courts over the past three weeks since Election Day have repeatedly dismissed the Trump campaign's claims in court.

卢卡斯：总统的律师鲁迪·朱利安尼和詹娜·埃利斯立即发表声明回应巴尔的言论。他们称，司法部并没有真正进行调查。他们表示将继续通过法院和州立法机构进行法律斗争。但不得不说，自选举日以来，过去三周里，法院多次在法庭上驳回特朗普竞选团队的主张。

KELLY: Meanwhile, in other Justice Department news — not a dull day on the justice beat, if there ever were one, Ryan. We learned that Barr has appointed John Durham as special counsel. Now, Durham was already investigating the origins of the Russia probe, so what changes?

凯利：与此同时，瑞安，在与司法部相关的其他新闻中，就司法来说今天并不是枯燥的日子，如果以前曾有过的话。我们得知，巴尔已任命约翰·达勒姆为特别检察官。现在，达勒姆已开始调查“通俄门”的起源，有何变化？

LUCAS: Well, what this appointment does is essentially shield Durham from being shut down with the change in administration. Now, Barr appointed Durham special counsel in mid-October. It's only been revealed today. We have a copy of the order. Barr says that he did this in order to ensure that no matter who won the election, Durham could continue his investigation.

卢卡斯：这项任命本质上是为了保护达勒姆不会因政府更迭而被开除。巴尔在10月中旬任命达勒姆为特别检察官。但这一任命今天才公布。我们拿到了任命的副本。巴尔表示，他这样做是为了确保无论谁赢得选举，达勒姆都能继续他的调查。

Now, to date, Durham's investigation is already a criminal probe. Only one person has been charged so far. That is a former FBI lawyer who has pleaded guilty to altering an email. Durham has been looking at American intelligence agencies as part of this investigation. Barr told the AP today that Durham's probe has narrowed and is now focused essentially on the FBI's activities in the Trump-Russia investigation. Barr's order also says that Durham will submit a report to the attorney general in a form that will allow it to be made public, so we have that to keep an eye out for in the year to come.

到目前为止，达勒姆的调查已成为刑事调查。目前只有一人被起诉。被起诉者是前联邦调查局律师，他承认自己篡改了一封电子邮件。达勒姆一直在调查美国情报机构。巴尔今天对美联社表示，达勒姆的调查范围已经缩小，现在主要集中于联邦调查局在特朗普“通俄门”调查中的行动。巴尔的命令还指出，达勒姆将向总检察长提交一份报告，以允许其公开，因此我们要在未来一年对此予以关注。

KELLY: All right, NPR justice correspondent Ryan Lucas.

凯利：好，以上是NPR新闻的司法记者瑞安·卢卡斯带来的报道。

Thank you, Ryan.

谢谢你，瑞安。

LUCAS: Thank you.

卢卡斯：谢谢。