美国国家公共电台 NPR 'Get Me Roger Stone' Profiles The Man Who's Wanted Trump To Run Since 1987

 

DAVID GREENE, HOST:

So if you haven't heard of the self-described dirty trickster Roger Stone, you might be missing out. And it is not just Stone who says so.

MORGAN PEHME: We thought that Roger being a pot-smoking bodybuilding dandy and that he and his wife are swingers, that we thought this is an incredible character to tell a story that in any other context might be kind of boring.

GREENE: That is Morgan Pehme. He's one of the directors of a new film called "Get Me Roger Stone." Stone is a Republican political consultant¹, and he is infamous² for his ruthless tactics. The new film was initially⁴ going to be about the degradation⁵ of our democracy, but it turned into a film about the making of President Trump⁶, which Roger Stone was involved in.

(SOUNDBITE OF DOCUMENTARY, "GET ME ROGER STONE")

ROGER STONE: Those who say I have no soul, those who say I have no principles are losers. Those are bitter losers. Everything I have done, everything I have worked for is to propel ideas, any political philosophy that I want to see dominant⁷ in government.

GREENE: That is the voice of Roger Stone in the film about him. I asked director Morgan Pehme what first got him interested in this guy.

PEHME: There were two things that really drew us to him. The first was that he embraces infamy⁸. It's, you know, there's a lot of people in politics who do horrible things, but they paper over their misdeeds, and they try to come out absolutely pure.

Roger is the antithesis⁹ of that. He absolutely wears his infamy and is only too happy to be the despicable villain¹⁰ that everybody hates. And so we thought that would make for a fascinating character to center a documentary on.

(SOUNDBITE OF DOCUMENTARY, "GET ME ROGER STONE")

STONE: Yeah, I live a pretty Machiavellian¹¹ life. And I'm a skeptic¹². I tend to believe the worst of people because I understand human nature. Human nature has never changed. That's why one of Stone's rules is that hate is a stronger motivator than love. That's because it is.

PEHME: Roger is this malevolent¹³ Forrest Gump. When anything dark and sinister¹⁴ is happening in our politics, Roger inevitably¹⁵ is lurking¹⁶ in the shadows with some sort of relationship to the misdeeds that had been done.

GREENE: I told the director that he had to tell our listeners what the title "Get Me Roger Stone" refers to.

PEHME: "Get Me Roger Stone" is about how indispensable Roger has been to virtually every bigwig in Republican politics since Nixon. Roger was the youngest person called before the Watergate grand jury when he was all of 19 years old. And president after president after president, and more so than any president Donald Trump, have always said, get me Roger Stone.

GREENE: When does he realize that Donald Trump, you know, in his view is presidential material?

PEHME: I think he believed from day one that Trump was a legitimate¹⁷ candidate. Now, certainly Trump's previous flirtations with running for the presidency¹⁸, it's hard to look at them as anything other than publicity¹⁹ stunts²⁰.

But Roger was always dead serious about the effectiveness that Trump could convey as a candidate, the outsider image that he was going to go in, and he was going to smash the status quo in Washington, the successful businessman who would bring that type of acumen²¹ to the White House that was sorely missing in Washington. And then the larger than life charisma²² that Trump exemplifies, those were in Roger's mind winning components²³.

And for years, Roger was ridiculed²⁴. And, you know, we thought it was absolutely fanciful for the first many years that we spent with him that the idea that Trump could be a legitimate candidate. But Roger consistently sung the same tune²⁵, and ultimately he was completely vindicated²⁶.

(SOUNDBITE OF DOCUMENTARY, "GET ME ROGER STONE")

STONE: This is the manifestation²⁷ of a dream I've had since 1988. And I've always thought Donald Trump had the size and the courage and the [expletive] to become president of the United States.

GREENE: There are some who do give Roger Stone credit for electing Donald Trump, including Roger Stone himself. Should he get credit?

PEHME: Absolutely. The person who deserves the most credit is Donald Trump. After Trump, the person who deserves the most credit is Roger. Roger came up with the idea for the Trump presidential run, was Trump's closest political adviser²⁸ for the last three decades, fashioned his political philosophy. And for the first year of the Trump campaign in this current cycle, it was really a three-man operation led by Roger.

Other people, kind of like the Steve Bannons, the Kellyanne Conways, they were essentially²⁹ Johnny-come-latelies (ph). They came in the final months, and they got a whole bunch of credit for it, but they didn't lay the groundwork the way that Roger had.

GREENE: This film is at many moments fun. At times, you can forget that many of Roger Stone's critics, they think he has encouraged people to lie, to create fake news in order to get candidates to win. I mean, I guess it's just worth reminding people of what his critics say.

PEHME: Those things are not only said about him, but I think that Roger himself would admit that most of those things are true. What we wanted to do was to give Roger the opportunity to tell his own story.

What was so interesting from our perspective was to see how Roger perceives the world, how Roger would answer to the fact that his mega lobbying firm in the '80s was known as the Torturers' Lobby because they had a cottage industry in representing third world dictators who were absolutely murderous, horrible, repugnant people. Roger is only too happy to say that I'm really happy with our lobbying company because we made a lot of money.

GREENE: For many of the interview moments with Roger Stone, there was a martini on the table next to him, but it's - was it gin or vodka? Let me start with that.

PEHME: It's vodka martini. And he actually learned his martini recipe from one of his idols³⁰ and mentors³¹, Richard Nixon.

GREENE: (Laughter) That's amazing.

PEHME: I do know that Roger can hold his liquor, but he's been known to order a martini and actually pay off the bartender to fill it with water, so particularly when he's drinking with reporters that he gets the reporters really drunk, and then he can feign³² drunkenness to take advantage of that.

GREENE: Oh, my goodness.

PEHME: That's how devious³³ he is, David.

GREENE: Was there vodka in there or water when you were talking to him?

PEHME: There was absolutely vodka, I can attest³⁴ to that.

GREENE: Well, listen. It's been great talking to you. And best of luck with the film.

PEHME: Thank you so much, David.

(SOUNDBITE OF THE BLACK KEYS SONG, "GOLD ON THE CEILING")

GREENE: Getting reporters drunk is a tactic³ that is just plain wrong. The documentary "Get Me Roger Stone" releases on Netflix today and in theaters in Los Angeles and New York.

1 consultant   

n.顾问；会诊医师，专科医生

参考例句：

• He is a consultant on law affairs to the mayor.他是市长的一个法律顾问。
• Originally,Gar had agreed to come up as a consultant.原来，加尔只答应来充当我们的顾问。

2 infamous   

adj.声名狼藉的，臭名昭著的，邪恶的

参考例句：

• He was infamous for his anti-feminist attitudes.他因反对女性主义而声名狼藉。
• I was shocked by her infamous behaviour.她的无耻行径令我震惊。

3 tactic   

n.战略，策略；adj.战术的，有策略的

参考例句：

• Reducing prices is a common sales tactic.降价是常用的销售策略。
• She had often used the tactic of threatening to resign.她惯用以辞职相威胁的手法。

4 initially   

adv.最初，开始

参考例句：

• The ban was initially opposed by the US.这一禁令首先遭到美国的反对。
• Feathers initially developed from insect scales.羽毛最初由昆虫的翅瓣演化而来。

5 degradation   

n.降级；低落；退化；陵削；降解；衰变

参考例句：

• There are serious problems of land degradation in some arid zones.在一些干旱地带存在严重的土地退化问题。
• Gambling is always coupled with degradation.赌博总是与堕落相联系。

6 trump   

n.王牌，法宝；v.打出王牌，吹喇叭

参考例句：

• He was never able to trump up the courage to have a showdown.他始终鼓不起勇气摊牌。
• The coach saved his star player for a trump card.教练保留他的明星选手，作为他的王牌。

7 dominant   

adj.支配的，统治的；占优势的；显性的；n.主因，要素，主要的人(或物)；显性基因

参考例句：

• The British were formerly dominant in India.英国人从前统治印度。
• She was a dominant figure in the French film industry.她在法国电影界是个举足轻重的人物。

8 infamy   

n.声名狼藉，出丑，恶行

参考例句：

• They may grant you power,honour,and riches but afflict you with servitude,infamy,and poverty.他们可以给你权力、荣誉和财富，但却用奴役、耻辱和贫穷来折磨你。
• Traitors are held in infamy.叛徒为人所不齿。

9 antithesis   

n.对立；相对

参考例句：

• The style of his speech was in complete antithesis to mine.他和我的讲话方式完全相反。
• His creation was an antithesis to academic dogmatism of the time.他的创作与当时学院派的教条相对立。

10 villain   

n.反派演员，反面人物；恶棍；问题的起因

参考例句：

• He was cast as the villain in the play.他在戏里扮演反面角色。
• The man who played the villain acted very well.扮演恶棍的那个男演员演得很好。

11 machiavellian   

adj.权谋的，狡诈的

参考例句：

• A Machiavellian plot was suspected.人们怀疑背后有不可告人的阴谋。
• In this layer,Obama implied American policies that are cautious and Machiavellian.在这个层面，奥巴马含蓄地表达了美国的谨慎、权谋的（新）政策。

12 skeptic   

n.怀疑者，怀疑论者，无神论者

参考例句：

• She is a skeptic about the dangers of global warming.她是全球变暖危险的怀疑论者。
• How am I going to convince this skeptic that she should attention to my research?我将如何使怀疑论者确信她应该关注我的研究呢？

13 malevolent   

adj.有恶意的，恶毒的

参考例句：

• Why are they so malevolent to me?他们为什么对我如此恶毒？
• We must thwart his malevolent schemes.我们决不能让他的恶毒阴谋得逞。

14 sinister   

adj.不吉利的，凶恶的，左边的

参考例句：

• There is something sinister at the back of that series of crimes.在这一系列罪行背后有险恶的阴谋。
• Their proposals are all worthless and designed out of sinister motives.他们的建议不仅一钱不值，而且包藏祸心。

15 inevitably   

adv.不可避免地；必然发生地

参考例句：

• In the way you go on,you are inevitably coming apart.照你们这样下去，毫无疑问是会散伙的。
• Technological changes will inevitably lead to unemployment.技术变革必然会导致失业。

16 lurking   

潜在

参考例句：

• Why are you lurking around outside my house? 你在我房子外面鬼鬼祟祟的，想干什么？
• There is a suspicious man lurking in the shadows. 有一可疑的人躲在阴暗中。 来自《现代英汉综合大词典》

17 legitimate   

adj.合法的，合理的，合乎逻辑的；v.使合法

参考例句：

• Sickness is a legitimate reason for asking for leave.生病是请假的一个正当的理由。
• That's a perfectly legitimate fear.怀有这种恐惧完全在情理之中。

18 presidency   

n.总统(校长，总经理)的职位(任期)

参考例句：

• Roosevelt was elected four times to the presidency of the United States.罗斯福连续当选四届美国总统。
• Two candidates are emerging as contestants for the presidency.两位候选人最终成为总统职位竞争者。

19 publicity   

n.众所周知，闻名；宣传，广告

参考例句：

• The singer star's marriage got a lot of publicity.这位歌星的婚事引起了公众的关注。
• He dismissed the event as just a publicity gimmick.他不理会这件事，只当它是一种宣传手法。

20 stunts   

n.惊人的表演( stunt的名词复数 )；（广告中）引人注目的花招；愚蠢行为；危险举动v.阻碍…发育[生长]，抑制，妨碍( stunt的第三人称单数 )

参考例句：

• He did all his own stunts. 所有特技都是他自己演的。
• The plane did a few stunts before landing. 飞机着陆前做了一些特技。 来自《简明英汉词典》

21 acumen   

n.敏锐，聪明

参考例句：

• She has considerable business acumen.她的经营能力绝非一般。
• His business acumen has made his very successful.他的商业头脑使他很成功。

22 charisma   

n.(大众爱戴的)领袖气质，魅力

参考例句：

• He has enormous charisma. He is a giant of a man.他有超凡的个人魅力，是个伟人。
• I don't have the charisma to pull a crowd this size.我没有那么大的魅力，能吸引这么多人。

23 components   

（机器、设备等的）构成要素，零件，成分； 成分( component的名词复数 )； [物理化学]组分； [数学]分量； （混合物的）组成部分

参考例句：

• the components of a machine 机器部件
• Our chemistry teacher often reduces a compound to its components in lab. 在实验室中化学老师常把化合物分解为各种成分。

24 ridiculed   

v.嘲笑，嘲弄，奚落( ridicule的过去式和过去分词 )

参考例句：

• Biosphere 2 was ultimately ridiculed as a research debade, as exfravagant pseudoscience. 生物圈2号最终被讥讽为科研上的大失败，代价是昂贵的伪科学。 来自《简明英汉词典》
• She ridiculed his insatiable greed. 她嘲笑他的贪得无厌。 来自《简明英汉词典》

25 tune   

n.调子；和谐，协调；v.调音，调节，调整

参考例句：

• He'd written a tune,and played it to us on the piano.他写了一段曲子，并在钢琴上弹给我们听。
• The boy beat out a tune on a tin can.那男孩在易拉罐上敲出一首曲子。

26 vindicated   

v.澄清（某人/某事物）受到的责难或嫌疑( vindicate的过去式和过去分词 )；表明或证明（所争辩的事物）属实、正当、有效等；维护

参考例句：

• I have every confidence that this decision will be fully vindicated. 我完全相信这一决定的正确性将得到充分证明。
• Subsequent events vindicated the policy. 后来的事实证明那政策是对的。 来自《简明英汉词典》

27 manifestation   

n.表现形式；表明；现象

参考例句：

• Her smile is a manifestation of joy.她的微笑是她快乐的表现。
• What we call mass is only another manifestation of energy.我们称之为质量的东西只是能量的另一种表现形态。

28 adviser   

n.劝告者，顾问

参考例句：

• They employed me as an adviser.他们聘请我当顾问。
• Our department has engaged a foreign teacher as phonetic adviser.我们系已经聘请了一位外籍老师作为语音顾问。

29 essentially   

adv.本质上，实质上，基本上

参考例句：

• Really great men are essentially modest.真正的伟人大都很谦虚。
• She is an essentially selfish person.她本质上是个自私自利的人。

30 idols   

偶像( idol的名词复数 )； 受崇拜的人或物； 受到热爱和崇拜的人或物； 神像

参考例句：

• The genii will give evidence against those who have worshipped idols. 魔怪将提供证据来反对那些崇拜偶像的人。 来自英汉非文学 - 文明史
• Teenagers are very sequacious and they often emulate the behavior of their idols. 青少年非常盲从，经常模仿他们的偶像的行为。

31 mentors   

n.（无经验之人的）有经验可信赖的顾问( mentor的名词复数 )v.（无经验之人的）有经验可信赖的顾问( mentor的第三人称单数 )

参考例句：

• Beacham and McNamara, my two mentors, had both warned me. 我的两位忠实朋友，比彻姆和麦克纳马拉都曾经警告过我。 来自辞典例句
• These are the kinds of contacts that could evolve into mentors. 这些人是可能会成为你导师。 来自互联网

32 feign   

vt.假装，佯作

参考例句：

• He used to feign an excuse.他惯于伪造口实。
• She knew that her efforts to feign cheerfulness weren't convincing.她明白自己强作欢颜是瞒不了谁的。

33 devious   

adj.不坦率的，狡猾的；迂回的，曲折的

参考例句：

• Susan is a devious person and we can't depend on her.苏姗是个狡猾的人，我们不能依赖她。
• He is a man who achieves success by devious means.他这个人通过不正当手段获取成功。

34 attest   

vt.证明，证实；表明

参考例句：

• I can attest to the absolute truth of his statement. 我可以证实他的话是千真万确的。
• These ruins sufficiently attest the former grandeur of the place. 这些遗迹充分证明此处昔日的宏伟。