【英语语言学习】窃听丑闻

This is TELL ME MORE from NPR News. I'm Celeste Headlee. Michel Martin is away. Coming up, we'll talk about the glaring lack of diversity in Silicon¹ Valley and what one group is trying to do about it. That's in just a minute.

 

But first, the leaks from Edward Snowden are apparently² still rolling in. Snowden used to work for an NSA - National Security Agency - contractor³, and he's currently in Russia. Today, the Spanish newspaper El Mundo says it's obtained documents showing the NSA monitored more than 60 million phone calls in that country in just one month. That comes just a week after allegations that the NSA monitored the communications of 35 world leaders, and Germany's Angela Merkel says she's one of them. Some European heads of state say this alleged⁴ spying is completely unacceptable and shocking. We wanted to get some overseas perspectives on the story, so we turn now to two European journalists who've been watching it closely. Gregor Peter Schmitz is the Washington bureau chief for the German newsmagazine Der Spiegel. He joins us by phone from Brussels where he's reporting on the EU summit.

 

GREGOR PETER SCHMITZ: Hi, thanks for having me.

 

HEADLEE: And here in our DC studio, we have Laure Mandeville. She's U.S. bureau chief of the French newspaper Le Figaro. Laure, thanks so much for coming in.

 

LAURE MANDEVILLE: Hi, thank you for inviting⁵ me.

 

HEADLEE: Greg, let's begin with you. You're probably hearing directly from some diplomats⁶ in Brussels that were there from the EU summit. What are you hearing?

 

SCHMITZ: Well, I mean, obviously the latest revelations have been a game changer again, I would say. I mean, we have been reporting on this story now for a few months. So it's not the first revelation that is coming out. But I think the public opinion that has already soured on the Americans a while ago has now dramatically shifted because now, even the leaders like Angela Merkel, like members of her own party, that, in the past, tried to defend the Americans or tried to ignore the subject during the electoral campaign, are now forced or compelled to address it.

 

And I think there is a real outrage⁷, not just in Brussels, but in several European capitals. I think my colleague will talk about the current mood in France, where President Hollande was actually pretty outspoken⁸ here at the Brussels summit and was pushing for more stricter data regulation and data protection in Europe. So, yeah, there is real outrage.

 

HEADLEE: And so, Laure, let's go to you and talk about the reaction from France. The French president, Francois Hollande, has called for a new code of conduct on spying. What does he mean?

 

MANDEVILLE: Well, I guess he would like a more transparent⁹ cooperation between the U.S. and the allies and not spying on presidents which are allies' countries. I think, basically, the government in France is trying to respond to public opinion. Public opinion in France is aware that spying is something which has been going back thousands of years, and the French are people who are aware of the importance of the government.

 

And they have this idea that government has to be strong, has to do some spying. You know, they are, in that sense, not necessarily absolutely outraged¹⁰. The French are aware that their own government is also - has some programs of spying. The difference is the magnitude, I think.

 

HEADLEE: Let me play you a comment here from P.J. Crowley. He's a former U.S. assistant secretary of state, and this is what he told NPR over the weekend.

 

P.J. CROWLEY: Europeans have a different view of privacy than Americans do. So I think there is a difference of attitude or perspective on this. That said, I don't think it should shock anyone that governments spy on each other.

 

HEADLEE: Gregor, he says two things there. Number one, people shouldn't be surprised by this, that this is going on. And European heads of state who are complaining about the U.S. are also, to a certain extent, overseeing programs of domestic and international spying. And the other thing he says is that there's a different view of privacy in Europe than the United States. What do you think that means? And if you think - do think that's true?

 

SCHMITZ: I think that is a very important distinction actually 'cause it is true. I mean, most high-ranking officials and politicians are of course aware of the programs that my colleague was alluding¹¹ to, and actually, that came up during a discussion at the EU summit. Somebody who participated told me that they were debating that over dinner, and they were saying, well, we are not exactly angels here - and the person that was spied on was called Angela. So they were admitting themselves that any moment a German, British, French, Spanish, Italian Edward Snowden could come up and could maybe disclose stuff that has been going on in Europe for years. So they know that they are not innocent themselves.

 

However, I think you really have to distinguish between politicians and the general public, and there is a dramatically different view of privacy in Europe. I mean, and I think that has two reasons. A, it's basically just our history, particularly in Germany where people sometimes lived through two dictatorships in a row - first the Nazi¹² dictatorship, then the Communist dictatorship. So they are very, very wary¹³ of spying programs, of state-controlled surveillance. And the other thing is that even in everyday life, even people that might not have that historical baggage, the way people deal with big data and with privacy is just very different in Europe. Starting with credit cards, actually - I mean, far fewer Europeans or Germans own credit cards. So they are much more reluctant to hand over their data to credit card providers, to phone companies and also to, frankly¹⁴, to people running political campaigns. I mean, we are always - we were fascinated with the big data development in the American campaign.

 

But at the same time, people were also a little freaked out because they are concerned that that trend might reach Europe, as well, in the near future. But they are very reluctant to even tell people who they voted for or to hand out personal data. When you go to a hair cutter, somebody asks for your e-mail address, that is basically unheard of in Europe when it's a regular occurrence in the United States.

 

HEADLEE: If you're just joining us, we're speaking with the Washington bureau chief of Der Spiegel, who you just heard - Gregor Peter Schmitz - and U.S. bureau chief of Le Figaro, Laure Mandeville. And, Laure, let's examine this just a little further 'cause there may be some Americans who are thinking, wow, look at those naive¹⁵ Europeans who are so shocked to find that they're being spied on. And I want to be clear that there's no evidence that any phone calls were listened to. What the NSA collected was data on when the phone calls were made and the phone numbers. So let's be clear on that - bad enough, I grant you, but there may be this idea that Europeans look a little bit naive.

 

MANDEVILLE: Well, maybe. And I think, in a way, there is some kind of naivety¹⁶, you know, in thinking that in a time of Internet, of cell phones, of everything being absolutely transparent - I think the new phenomenon is that we have a transparent planet and that we are totally naked in front of governments, big companies, which are controlling these assets, these technologies. And I think people - this outrage that we are seeing in Europe is actually the realization¹⁷ of that. And I think the Americans are not outraged to the same extent, but why is that? I'm not totally sure that the Americans have a different approach to privacy, but I think that there has been a sort of absolutely key moment in the American history recently, which is 9/11. And that after 9/11, the Americans have, to a certain extent, decided¹⁸ to have this trade-off between privacy and security.

 

And that basically, when you see the polling results - you know, polls in the U.S., still a majority of Americans - after the Snowden revelations about domestic programs in the U.S. - were saying, OK, we are worried about privacy, but we are more worried about security. So we are worried that the NSA's handling data about us, but if they can catch terrorists - so there is this idea, you know, of a trade-off. And I think in Europe, people are not so aware of all the cooperation which exists between the intelligence services of the U.S. and Europe, which is also benefiting to Europeans to a certain extent. And they see more the cost. The cost is that they see an ally, but still a foreign country...

 

HEADLEE: Right.

 

MANDEVILLE: ...Spying on them and being able to gather a huge amount of data about them. And I think the Americans would be not very happy if France had the same capacity, frankly. I think if the Americans were in our place and they would certainly discover that there is this Big Brother Europe or Big Brother France or Germany being able to...

 

HEADLEE: Russia would be the worst I think, yeah, but still.

 

MANDEVILLE: Russia would be terrible. China would be terrible.

 

HEADLEE: Yeah.

 

MANDEVILLE: Remember, in 2010, the outrage in the U.S. because they were discovering that the - there was this hacking¹⁹ process.

 

HEADLEE: Right. Well, let me bring this back to you, Gregor, because there has been comments from members of the intelligence community in the U.S. that the first place many European governments come to when they have a concern about terrorism - when they have a concern about a possible bomb, a possible threat or something occurs - the first place they come is to the U.S. to get our help in terms of intelligence gathering²⁰. What's the response to that?

 

SCHMITZ: That is true, and there has been a tremendous amount of cooperation between many European countries and the U.S. However, I think what you have to bear in mind is that, A, the perception of the war on terror and of the limits of the war on terror, and if maybe America has overreacted in that war on terror - it's different in Europe. And particularly if you look at public opinion, but also increasingly if you talk to government officials in Europe people just say, well, they are basically punishing themselves now because they have taken this security apparatus²¹ to a level that they can't even control anymore. And I don't think it's a fair argument to say only because European authorities reach out to the Americans when they want more information on an alleged spier, so that gives the government the right to spy on all regular citizens to an extent that is shocking.

 

There were revelations about this spying incident in France in the past week, when the numbers were just staggering, of 70 million calls that American authorities apparently eavesdropped²² on in just one month. So I think that is what scares people. I don't think people are opposed to intelligence gathering in the war on terror. What they are afraid of is this just very random²³, indiscriminatory collection of major data, which gives the impression that everybody can be a target at any given moment.

 

HEADLEE: Well, what I'm hearing from both of you is it's not the existence of the program, but the size. Washington bureau chief, Der Spiegel, Gregor Peter Schmitz, joining us by phone from Brussels. And U.S. bureau chief of Le Figaro, Laure Mandeville joining us here in our studios in Washington, D.C. Thank you so much to both of you.

 

MANDEVILLE: Thank you.

 

SCHMITZ: Thanks so much.

1 silicon   

n.硅(旧名矽)

参考例句：

• This company pioneered the use of silicon chip.这家公司开创了使用硅片的方法。
• A chip is a piece of silicon about the size of a postage stamp.芯片就是一枚邮票大小的硅片。

2 apparently   

adv.显然地；表面上，似乎

参考例句：

• An apparently blind alley leads suddenly into an open space.山穷水尽，豁然开朗。
• He was apparently much surprised at the news.他对那个消息显然感到十分惊异。

3 contractor   

n.订约人，承包人，收缩肌

参考例句：

• The Tokyo contractor was asked to kick $ 6000 back as commission.那个东京的承包商被要求退还6000美元作为佣金。
• The style of house the contractor builds depends partly on the lay of the land.承包商所建房屋的式样，有几分要看地势而定。

4 alleged   

a.被指控的，嫌疑的

参考例句：

• It was alleged that he had taken bribes while in office. 他被指称在任时收受贿赂。
• alleged irregularities in the election campaign 被指称竞选运动中的不正当行为

5 inviting   

adj.诱人的，引人注目的

参考例句：

• An inviting smell of coffee wafted into the room.一股诱人的咖啡香味飘进了房间。
• The kitchen smelled warm and inviting and blessedly familiar.这间厨房的味道温暖诱人，使人感到亲切温馨。

6 diplomats   

n.外交官( diplomat的名词复数 )；有手腕的人，善于交际的人

参考例句：

• These events led to the expulsion of senior diplomats from the country. 这些事件导致一些高级外交官被驱逐出境。
• The court has no jurisdiction over foreign diplomats living in this country. 法院对驻本国的外交官无裁判权。 来自《简明英汉词典》

7 outrage   

n.暴行，侮辱，愤怒；vt.凌辱，激怒

参考例句：

• When he heard the news he reacted with a sense of outrage.他得悉此事时义愤填膺。
• We should never forget the outrage committed by the Japanese invaders.我们永远都不应该忘记日本侵略者犯下的暴行。

8 outspoken   

adj.直言无讳的，坦率的，坦白无隐的

参考例句：

• He was outspoken in his criticism.他在批评中直言不讳。
• She is an outspoken critic of the school system in this city.她是这座城市里学校制度的坦率的批评者。

9 transparent   

adj.明显的，无疑的；透明的

参考例句：

• The water is so transparent that we can see the fishes swimming.水清澈透明，可以看到鱼儿游来游去。
• The window glass is transparent.窗玻璃是透明的。

10 outraged   

a.震惊的，义愤填膺的

参考例句：

• Members of Parliament were outraged by the news of the assassination. 议会议员们被这暗杀的消息激怒了。
• He was outraged by their behavior. 他们的行为使他感到愤慨。

11 alluding   

提及，暗指( allude的现在分词 )

参考例句：

• He didn't mention your name but I was sure he was alluding to you. 他没提你的名字，但是我确信他是暗指你的。
• But in fact I was alluding to my physical deficiencies. 可我实在是为自己的容貌寒心。

12 Nazi   

n.纳粹分子，adj.纳粹党的，纳粹的

参考例句：

• They declare the Nazi regime overthrown and sue for peace.他们宣布纳粹政权已被推翻，并出面求和。
• Nazi closes those war criminals inside their concentration camp.纳粹把那些战犯关在他们的集中营里。

13 wary   

adj.谨慎的，机警的，小心的

参考例句：

• He is wary of telling secrets to others.他谨防向他人泄露秘密。
• Paula frowned,suddenly wary.宝拉皱了皱眉头，突然警惕起来。

14 frankly   

adv.坦白地，直率地；坦率地说

参考例句：

• To speak frankly, I don't like the idea at all.老实说，我一点也不赞成这个主意。
• Frankly speaking, I'm not opposed to reform.坦率地说，我不反对改革。

15 naive   

adj.幼稚的，轻信的；天真的

参考例句：

• It's naive of you to believe he'll do what he says.相信他会言行一致，你未免太单纯了。
• Don't be naive.The matter is not so simple.你别傻乎乎的。事情没有那么简单。

16 naivety   

n.天真，纯朴，幼稚

参考例句：

• Mozart's music is characterized by its naivety and clarity.莫扎特的音乐特色是纯朴兴清澈。
• She has lost none of her naivety.她丝毫没有失去那份天真烂漫。

17 realization   

n.实现；认识到，深刻了解

参考例句：

• We shall gladly lend every effort in our power toward its realization.我们将乐意为它的实现而竭尽全力。
• He came to the realization that he would never make a good teacher.他逐渐认识到自己永远不会成为好老师。

18 decided   

adj.决定了的，坚决的；明显的，明确的

参考例句：

• This gave them a decided advantage over their opponents.这使他们比对手具有明显的优势。
• There is a decided difference between British and Chinese way of greeting.英国人和中国人打招呼的方式有很明显的区别。

19 hacking   

n.非法访问计算机系统和数据库的活动

参考例句：

• The patient with emphysema is hacking all day. 这个肺气肿病人整天不断地干咳。
• We undertook the task of hacking our way through the jungle. 我们负责在丛林中开路。

20 gathering   

n.集会，聚会，聚集

参考例句：

• He called on Mr. White to speak at the gathering.他请怀特先生在集会上讲话。
• He is on the wing gathering material for his novels.他正忙于为他的小说收集资料。

21 apparatus   

n.装置，器械；器具，设备

参考例句：

• The school's audio apparatus includes films and records.学校的视听设备包括放映机和录音机。
• They had a very refined apparatus.他们有一套非常精良的设备。

22 eavesdropped   

偷听（别人的谈话）( eavesdrop的过去式和过去分词 )

参考例句：

• He eavesdropped on our conversation. 他偷听了我们的谈话。
• He has just eavesdropped two sweethearts. 他刚刚偷听了两个情人的谈话。

23 random   

adj.随机的；任意的；n.偶然的(或随便的)行动

参考例句：

• The list is arranged in a random order.名单排列不分先后。
• On random inspection the meat was found to be bad.经抽查，发现肉变质了。