PBS高端访谈:今年的美国选举大不同（在线收听）

Hari Sreenivasan: For more on how the political landscape is changing, NewsHour political reporter Dan Bush joins us now. This is unlike campaigns we've seen in the past. This is kind of the time we're especially heading into the month or two before the party conventions. It's full steam ahead. The leaders are really, we're down to two people, but they're not having any events.

Dan Bush: That's right. This is unusual and nothing like we've seen in recent memory. As you said, this is the moment where there are more rallies. They're trying to reach as many voters as they can in person. And yet here we are. We saw Senator Sanders and former Vice President Biden start canceling their events last week. They're pulling back. And these campaigns are big operations, Hari. It's like a company. Staffers are working from home in many cases now. So they're trying to, number one, reduce the exposure. Obviously, sort of reduce the number of large crowd gatherings and the number two, find creative ways to reach voters virtually.

Hari Sreenivasan: So what does that virtual town hall campaign rally look like?

Dan Bush: So we're starting to see that in the last week. Biden had his virtual town hall, essentially sort of like imagine a large teleconference with a lot of people where Biden can speak even though he's not in the room. That was in Illinois. We saw Sanders do a kind of online fireside chat. And even ahead of the debate tonight, the Sanders campaign announced today that they're doing a sort of live stream where they're sitting down with campaign officials and some experts to talk about the Coronavirus, to talk about the campaign. So they're trying to find ways to reach people, even when the candidates themselves can't be out there talking to voters, doing all of the sort of general election year things we're used to seeing.

Hari Sreenivasan: I should also mention the Trump campaign has canceled some of its events as well. So when you look at all three of these gentlemen, if they are the presumptive leaders of their parties and possibly could be competing to be president, they are smack dab in the, in the demographic that is at greatest risk, right? They are officially the elderly.

Dan Bush: That's right. That's right. And we saw President Trump just announced yesterday that he had been, the White House released this, that he had been tested for coronavirus. That test came back negative. We're waiting to see sort of how Bernie Sanders and Joe Biden approach that. But you're exactly right. And that's another reason why the campaigns, in addition to sort of following the guidelines, for example, Joe Biden in canceling his election night in-person rally on the second Super Tuesday, just this past Tuesday, he cited official state guidelines. This was in Ohio saying, reducing sort of large crowds, large gatherings. But also these candidates are out there, you know, at a given rally shaking hundreds of hands, right? Taking the selfies that we see so much. And that's another reason why these campaigns are saying, wait a minute, let's slow this down. We do have to sort of adjust to this new reality.

Hari Sreenivasan: And does the lack of in-person campaigns give either Joe Biden or Bernie Sanders any kind of an edge, whether it's based on their kind of online infrastructure or who gets more from this stuff?

Dan Bush: Such a good question. And, you know, sort of a double edged sword. On the one hand, Bernie Sanders has built a following going all the back in 2016 with these large rallies, with these large events where sort of his supporters can can get energized, where the media sees that, where Sanders gets attention. That's one of the strengths of his campaign. It does hurt him, especially this point where he's behind in the delegate count, where he's trying to regain momentum. Not being able to be out there is difficult for Sanders. On the other hand, we are seeing him sort of breakout his full arsenal of digital tools. He has a robust organizing effort online. So he is well positioned to sort of take advantage of this virtual moment, if you will, to reach out to voters that way. Biden, on the other hand, has struggled a little bit more to adjust to this, this reality of campaigning in 2020. He's catching up quickly, though, and he actually depends a little bit less on those large crowds, usually does smaller events. So arguably, Biden is actually slightly better positioned sort of as they deal with this with his moment in the campaign.

Hari Sreenivasan: All right. NewsHour politics reporter Dan Bush.Thanks so much for joining us.

Dan Bush: Thank you.

哈里·斯里尼瓦桑：关于政治格局的变化，请听《新闻一小时》政治类记者丹·布什发回的报道。这次跟我们以往见到的竞选活动不同。这次竞选活动距离政党代表大会只有一两个月了，是全力冲刺的阶段了。我们觉得有2位领袖比较有希望，但他俩没有举行什么竞选活动。

丹·布什：是的。这很不寻常，跟最近的情况大相径庭。正如你所说，现在这个节骨眼应该有更多的集会。大家努力跟尽可能多的选民当面接触。我们在这里了解到的情况如下。我们注意到，参议员伯尼·桑德斯和前副总统乔·拜登上周开始取消了竞选活动。他俩变卦了。这些竞选活动都需要很大手笔的运营，哈里，就像运营一个公司那样。很多员工现在都在家远程办公。所以他们正在努力要做的第一件事就是降低曝光率。比较明显的其一是减少人群聚集的次数，其二是找到有创造力的方法来接触选民。

哈里·斯里尼瓦桑：那么，虚拟市政厅竞选机会是什么样子呢？

丹·布什：上周开始有这种类型的集会出现。拜登设立了自己的虚拟市政厅，有点像是想象一个大型的网络会议，有很多人参加。拜登即使没在会议室里也能说话。在伊利诺斯州，我们看到桑德斯围炉谈话。而就在今晚举行辩论前，桑德斯竞选团队今天宣布他们在做在线视频，届时他们会跟竞选工作人员和专家们一起坐下来，讨论新冠病毒以及竞选活动的事。所以，可以说他们正在寻找方法来接触选民，即便不能面对面地交谈，他们也竭尽全力地做着与大选有关的工作。

哈里·斯里尼瓦桑：我还要提一嘴——特朗普竞选团队也取消了一些活动。所以，这三人如果是各自政党的假定候选人的话，那可能可能成为总统角逐中的竞争对手，他们稳准狠地指向了那些人口统计中危险最高的人群，对吗？也就是老年人。

丹·布什：是的，没错。昨天，我们注意到特朗普宣布说自己也接受了新冠的检测。检测结果是阴性。我们正在观望桑德斯和拜登会怎么做。不过，你说的完全没毛病。除了遵循一定的指导原则之外，还有另一个原因：比如，拜登取消了第二个超级星期二的竞选之夜活动，也就是刚刚过去的这个星期二。拜登引用了官方的指导原则。拜登在爱荷华州表示要减少大规模人群聚集。但与此同时，这些候选人也在集会上与上百人握手，对吗？我们也看到了很多自拍照。这是这些竞选活动对外表示咱们减慢速度的另一个原因。我们需要适应这个新现实。

哈里·斯里尼瓦桑：缺乏当面沟通的竞选活动会让拜登或者桑德斯有一定的优势吗？无论是在线机会还是类似的行为。

丹·布什：这是个好问题。这是一面双刃剑。一方面，桑德斯2016年竞选时曾有大批人群的集会，他的支持者们因此感到振奋。媒体也注意到桑德斯获得了关注。这是桑德斯竞选活动的优势之一。不能面对面地做竞选活动确实对桑德斯不利，尤其是现在他票数落后的节骨眼上，他正在试着重新造势。不能面对面地做竞选活动，这对桑德斯来说是有难度的。另一方面，我们也注意到桑德斯突破了自己对数据工具的使用，在线组织活动也很用心。所以，桑德斯也充分利用在线竞选活动的特点来跟选民互动。另一方面，拜登适应这个过程就显得更吃力一些，但在线竞选活动会是2020年竞选的常态。不过，拜登追逐的速度也很快，拜登对大批选民集会的依赖度没那么高，他做的活动通常规模较小。所以，大概拜登相对来说在竞选活动的角逐中稍胜一筹。

哈里·斯里尼瓦桑：好的，感谢丹·布什为我们发回的报道。

丹·布什：谢谢大家。