美国国家公共电台 NPR--Sloppy handling of classified documents is very serious, ethics lawyer says

Sloppy¹ handling of classified documents is very serious, ethics² lawyer says

Transcript³

NPR's Leila Fadel talks to Richard Painter, former White House chief ethics lawyer, about ethical⁴ and legal implications of finding classified documents in an office that once belonged to Joe Biden.

LEILA FADEL, HOST:

OK, we just heard about how the media covered the discovery of classified documents at the Penn Biden Center. But what are the ethical and legal implications? For that, we're turning to Richard Painter via Skype. He was the chief ethics lawyer of the White House under President George W. Bush. Good morning.

RICHARD PAINTER: Good morning.

FADEL: So if you put your chief ethics lawyer cap on, what are you looking for going forward?

PAINTER: Well, first, it's critically important that we treat the classified information appropriately, which means keeping it in a secure information facility, a SCIF, and only have access to people who have the security clearance⁵. And sloppy handling of classified information is a very serious matter. This is something that I reiterated⁶ in 2005 to the White House staff after we had a scandal where someone intentionally⁷ leaked the name of CIA agent Valerie Plame in order to retaliate⁸ against her husband. But sloppy handling of classified information is very, very serious.

Now, that being said, that is not going to result in criminal charges simply if someone was sloppy, whether it's Hillary Clinton's email server or what happened here. On the other hand, if someone lies about having classified documents and refuses to turn them over - what happened at Mar-a-Lago - that is going to result in an FBI raid. And I'm surprised the FBI didn't raid more of Donald Trump's properties in light of what happened there. So there's a clear distinction between the criminal, on the one hand, and the incredibly sloppy handling of classified information that happened here, where somebody packed up boxes in the vice⁹ president's office and shipped them over to the Penn Biden Center. And there are a bunch of other controversies¹⁰ surrounding the Penn Biden Center. And then - they're unrelated, I'd emphasize. You know, but this is sloppy, to have done that, whoever packed the boxes.

FADEL: So in your view, in this case, this is carelessness rather than criminal in what you're seeing so far?

PAINTER: Yes, very, very careless. I mean, whoever is packing the boxes - you know, packing up the office of the vice president of the United States should be probably a lawyer from the counsel's office who could review documents because it's not just classified documents. Other government records, originals, cannot be removed from the premises¹¹. If it's a photocopy¹² of a nonclassified document or if, on the other hand, it's a - you know, that's OK. But if it's classified or it's an original of any document, you can't take it off of the premises.

FADEL: So what should have been done to ensure that the then-former Vice President Biden didn't have classified documents among his files?

PAINTER: Well, there should have been a review of these files first, before they left the vice president's office. They should have gone through everything and make absolutely sure there was no classified documents in there. Classified documents have a cover on them clearly indicating that there is a classified document inside. And so if someone had bothered to look, they would have seen that. When the documents arrived at his new office, they also should have been reviewed as well to ascertain¹³ that they only had documents that the then-former vice president had a right to retain.

FADEL: So clearly, these procedures that you're describing, at least in this case, weren't followed. Does President Biden then bear responsibility?

PAINTER: Well, I mean, ultimately, we do have responsibility for the work of our staff and - whether it's the vice president's office or, on the other hand, the people over at the Penn Biden Center, who also should have made sure that they only had that which they were entitled to have. And the president does bear responsibility, the boss does. That does not mean it's criminal responsibility. And once again, he did not refuse to turn over the documents. The - his lawyers and the president reported this when they found the documents. This is very different than the situation we had down in Mar-a-Lago.

FADEL: Why doesn't the National Archives seem to know when these sensitive documents go missing? I mean, in this case, it appears they only knew when Biden's lawyers told them. Why is that?

PAINTER: Well, this is a serious problem. We are not keeping track of classified information as we should be because we should know how many copies there are of classified documents and where they are. And we shouldn't just have copies of the classified documents floating around all over the place.

FADEL: Richard Painter is a former chief White House ethics lawyer. Last year, the former Republican ran as a Democrat¹⁴ in a U.S. House race in Minnesota. Thank you so much.

PAINTER: Well, thank you.

1 sloppy   

adj.邋遢的，不整洁的

参考例句：

• If you do such sloppy work again,I promise I'll fail you.要是下次作业你再马马虎虎，我话说在头里，可要给你打不及格了。
• Mother constantly picked at him for being sloppy.母亲不断地批评他懒散。

2 ethics   

n.伦理学；伦理观，道德标准

参考例句：

• The ethics of his profession don't permit him to do that.他的职业道德不允许他那样做。
• Personal ethics and professional ethics sometimes conflict.个人道德和职业道德有时会相互抵触。

3 transcript   

n.抄本，誊本，副本，肄业证书

参考例句：

• A transcript of the tapes was presented as evidence in court.一份录音带的文字本作为证据被呈交法庭。
• They wouldn't let me have a transcript of the interview.他们拒绝给我一份采访的文字整理稿。

4 ethical   

adj.伦理的，道德的，合乎道德的

参考例句：

• It is necessary to get the youth to have a high ethical concept.必须使青年具有高度的道德观念。
• It was a debate which aroused fervent ethical arguments.那是一场引发强烈的伦理道德争论的辩论。

5 clearance   

n.净空；许可(证)；清算；清除，清理

参考例句：

• There was a clearance of only ten centimetres between the two walls.两堵墙之间只有十厘米的空隙。
• The ship sailed as soon as it got clearance. 那艘船一办好离港手续立刻启航了。

6 reiterated   

反复地说，重申( reiterate的过去式和过去分词 )

参考例句：

• "Well, I want to know about it,'she reiterated. “嗯，我一定要知道你的休假日期，"她重复说。 来自英汉文学 - 嘉莉妹妹
• Some twenty-two years later President Polk reiterated and elaborated upon these principles. 大约二十二年之后，波尔克总统重申这些原则并且刻意阐释一番。

7 intentionally   

ad.故意地，有意地

参考例句：

• I didn't say it intentionally. 我是无心说的。
• The local authority ruled that he had made himself intentionally homeless and was therefore not entitled to be rehoused. 当地政府裁定他是有意居无定所，因此没有资格再获得提供住房。

8 retaliate   

v.报复，反击

参考例句：

• He sought every opportunity to retaliate against his enemy.他找机会向他的敌人反击。
• It is strictly forbidden to retaliate against the quality inspectors.严禁对质量检验人员进行打击报复。

9 vice   

n.坏事；恶习；[pl.]台钳，老虎钳；adj.副的

参考例句：

• He guarded himself against vice.他避免染上坏习惯。
• They are sunk in the depth of vice.他们堕入了罪恶的深渊。

10 controversies   

争论

参考例句：

• We offer no comment on these controversies here. 对于这些争议，我们在这里不作任何评论。 来自英汉非文学 - 历史
• The controversies surrounding population growth are unlikely to subside soon. 围绕着人口增长问题的争论看来不会很快平息。 来自辞典例句

11 premises   

n.建筑物，房屋

参考例句：

• According to the rules,no alcohol can be consumed on the premises.按照规定，场内不准饮酒。
• All repairs are done on the premises and not put out.全部修缮都在家里进行，不用送到外面去做。

12 photocopy   

n.影印本；v.影印

参考例句：

• The original reproduces clearly in a photocopy.原件复印得十分清晰。
• What's wrong with the photocopy machine?复印机出了什么问题？

13 ascertain   

vt.发现，确定，查明，弄清

参考例句：

• It's difficult to ascertain the coal deposits.煤储量很难探明。
• We must ascertain the responsibility in light of different situtations.我们必须根据不同情况判定责任。

14 democrat   

n.民主主义者，民主人士；民主党党员

参考例句：

• The Democrat and the Public criticized each other.民主党人和共和党人互相攻击。
• About two years later,he was defeated by Democrat Jimmy Carter.大约两年后，他被民主党人杰米卡特击败。