美国国家公共电台 NPR--Russia blames Ukrainian drones for explosions at two air bases within the country

Russia blames Ukrainian drones for explosions at two air bases within the country

Transcript¹

Max Bergmann of the Center for Strategic and International Studies joins NPR to discuss the implications of reported Ukrainian air strikes deep within Russia.

STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:

The war in Ukraine is spreading beyond its borders. Russia's defense² ministry³ reported explosions at two air bases inside Russia and Russia blames Ukrainian drones. Ukraine is not confirming if they're responsible. We've called Max Bergmann, a former U.S. diplomat⁴ and expert on European and Russian security at the Center for Strategic and International Studies. Welcome to the program.

MAX BERGMANN: Thanks for having me, Steve.

INSKEEP: Are you pretty confident that Ukraine really is responsible for these attacks?

BERGMANN: Yeah, I think this is - it's pretty clear Ukraine is responsible. There's been some pretty - I think maybe not direct statements by Ukrainian officials, but really hinting that - of their involvement. And this is something we've also seen from Ukraine before. They have struck at Russian territory previously⁵. But I think what makes this very different is the depth at which they were able to reach inside of Russia, striking a base on the Volga River, which is hundreds of miles from Ukraine.

INSKEEP: What exactly did the Ukrainians strike at that great distance, and what is its relevance⁶ to this war?

BERGMANN: Well, this was a strategic bomber⁷ air base that Russia was using to strike Ukrainian territory. And it - you know, this - the significance of this is that Russia - this is one of their most strategic bases. This is where they perhaps can have nuclear weapons as well. And to be able to strike so deep into Russian territory really calls into question Russian air defense, Russia's security procedures. And it demonstrates to Russia that Ukraine is - has the ability to put them under threat and will - I think significantly, it will cause some real issues within the Russian military.

INSKEEP: Well, let me think this through, though. Traditionally, this would be a normal part of a war. You don't give the enemy a safe haven⁸. Ukraine naturally would try to strike on the enemy's territory, the enemy's turf, if they can. But this is a nuclear-armed power with thousands of nuclear weapons that presumably would take extreme offense⁹ to strikes on its own territory. Haven't the U.S. and its allies tried to discourage this very thing?

BERGMANN: Well, the U.S. has, and I think the U.S. has made clear that any weapons that we provide, that we don't want those to be used against Russian territory, which is why this is significant, that this is - appears to be an organic weapon developed by the Ukrainians themselves or retrofitted essentially¹⁰. And I think, you know, what it sort of demonstrates is that Russia's nuclear blustering¹¹ earlier in the conflict has proved rather hollow.

There's been a number of world leaders in addition to Western leaders in India and China that have also advocated or pushed Moscow to tone down the nuclear rhetoric¹². And that right now is the one way that Russia has to escalate¹³ this conflict, because it is - it has escalated¹⁴. It is striking Ukrainian civilian¹⁵ infrastructure¹⁶ repeatedly and constantly. So Russia's ability to escalate would, I think, would be nuclear. And I don't think there's - I think that would have tremendous costs for Russia both internationally and I think domestically within its own public. I don't think there's domestic support within Russia to go to such an extreme step.

INSKEEP: I think you're telling me you're not terrified about a Russian nuclear strike. The possibility is out there, but you don't think it's really - they would see it in their interest yet.

BERGMANN: No, I think that's right. And I think what we've seen is that this isn't the first time that Ukraine has struck Russian territory, which didn't elicit¹⁷ a nuclear response. And we have to remember, what is Ukraine targeting? They're targeting a military target, unlike Russia, which is targeting civilian infrastructure. So I think this is very much inbounds of what we would consider - you know, maybe not rules of the game, but of a degree of, well, this is what an adversary¹⁸ is going to do in response to them being pummeled by missiles.

INSKEEP: I think you mentioned larger potential effects on Russia's military. Is there some broader strategic effect, that it would affect the morale¹⁹ or the approach or the thinking of Russia's military here?

BERGMANN: Yeah, I think Russia will have to examine its air defenses. Has it moved most of its air defenses into Ukraine? Does it need to create more depth? Does it need to shift how its forces are arrayed to prevent their destruction should there be an attack? And it will also simply be really uncomfortable for a lot of senior military officials inside the Kremlin that will be called to account. How could this happen? How could you allow this to occur? So I think it will add to sort of the infighting.

INSKEEP: Max Bergmann of the Center for Strategic and International Studies, thanks for your insights - really appreciate it.

BERGMANN: Thanks so much.

1 transcript   

n.抄本，誊本，副本，肄业证书

参考例句：

• A transcript of the tapes was presented as evidence in court.一份录音带的文字本作为证据被呈交法庭。
• They wouldn't let me have a transcript of the interview.他们拒绝给我一份采访的文字整理稿。

2 defense   

n.防御，保卫；[pl.]防务工事；辩护，答辩

参考例句：

• The accused has the right to defense.被告人有权获得辩护。
• The war has impacted the area with military and defense workers.战争使那个地区挤满了军队和防御工程人员。

3 ministry   

n.(政府的)部；牧师

参考例句：

• They sent a deputation to the ministry to complain.他们派了一个代表团到部里投诉。
• We probed the Air Ministry statements.我们调查了空军部的记录。

4 diplomat   

n.外交官，外交家；能交际的人，圆滑的人

参考例句：

• The diplomat threw in a joke, and the tension was instantly relieved.那位外交官插进一个笑话，紧张的气氛顿时缓和下来。
• He served as a diplomat in Russia before the war.战前他在俄罗斯当外交官。

5 previously   

adv.以前，先前（地）

参考例句：

• The bicycle tyre blew out at a previously damaged point.自行车胎在以前损坏过的地方又爆开了。
• Let me digress for a moment and explain what had happened previously.让我岔开一会儿，解释原先发生了什么。

6 relevance   

n.中肯，适当，关联，相关性

参考例句：

• Politicians' private lives have no relevance to their public roles.政治家的私生活与他们的公众角色不相关。
• Her ideas have lost all relevance to the modern world.她的想法与现代社会完全脱节。

7 bomber   

n.轰炸机，投弹手，投掷炸弹者

参考例句：

• He flew a bomber during the war.他在战时驾驶轰炸机。
• Detectives hunting the London bombers will be keen to interview him.追查伦敦爆炸案凶犯的侦探们急于对他进行讯问。

8 haven   

n.安全的地方，避难所，庇护所

参考例句：

• It's a real haven at the end of a busy working day.忙碌了一整天后，这真是一个安乐窝。
• The school library is a little haven of peace and quiet.学校的图书馆是一个和平且安静的小避风港。

9 offense   

n.犯规，违法行为；冒犯，得罪

参考例句：

• I hope you will not take any offense at my words. 对我讲的话请别见怪。
• His words gave great offense to everybody present.他的发言冲犯了在场的所有人。

10 essentially   

adv.本质上，实质上，基本上

参考例句：

• Really great men are essentially modest.真正的伟人大都很谦虚。
• She is an essentially selfish person.她本质上是个自私自利的人。

11 blustering   

adj.狂风大作的，狂暴的v.外强中干的威吓( bluster的现在分词 )；咆哮；（风）呼啸；狂吹

参考例句：

• It was five and a half o'clock now, and a raw, blustering morning. 这时才五点半，正是寒气逼人，狂风咆哮的早晨。 来自辞典例句
• So sink the shadows of night, blustering, rainy, and all paths grow dark. 夜色深沉，风狂雨骤；到处途暗路黑。 来自辞典例句

12 rhetoric   

n.修辞学，浮夸之言语

参考例句：

• Do you know something about rhetoric?你懂点修辞学吗？
• Behind all the rhetoric,his relations with the army are dangerously poised.在冠冕堂皇的言辞背后，他和军队的关系岌岌可危。

13 escalate   

v.(使)逐步增长(或发展)，(使)逐步升级

参考例句：

• It would tempt Israel's neighbors to escalate their demands.它将诱使以色列的邻国不断把他们的要求升级。
• Defeat could cause one side or other to escalate the conflict.失败可能会导致其中一方将冲突升级。

14 escalated   

v.（使）逐步升级( escalate的过去式和过去分词 )；（使）逐步扩大；（使）更高；（使）更大

参考例句：

• The fighting escalated into a full-scale war. 这场交战逐步扩大为全面战争。
• The demonstration escalated into a pitched battle with the police. 示威逐步升级，演变成了一场同警察的混战。

15 civilian   

adj.平民的，民用的，民众的

参考例句：

• There is no reliable information about civilian casualties.关于平民的伤亡还没有确凿的信息。
• He resigned his commission to take up a civilian job.他辞去军职而从事平民工作。

16 infrastructure   

n.下部构造，下部组织，基础结构，基础设施

参考例句：

• We should step up the development of infrastructure for research.加强科学基础设施建设。
• We should strengthen cultural infrastructure and boost various types of popular culture.加强文化基础设施建设，发展各类群众文化。

17 elicit   

v.引出,抽出,引起

参考例句：

• It was designed to elicit the best thinking within the government. 机构的设置是为了在政府内部集思广益。
• Don't try to elicit business secrets from me. I won't tell you anything. 你休想从我这里套问出我们的商业机密, 我什么都不会告诉你的。

18 adversary   

adj.敌手，对手

参考例句：

• He saw her as his main adversary within the company.他将她视为公司中主要的对手。
• They will do anything to undermine their adversary's reputation.他们会不择手段地去损害对手的名誉。

19 morale   

n.道德准则，士气，斗志

参考例句：

• The morale of the enemy troops is sinking lower every day.敌军的士气日益低落。
• He tried to bolster up their morale.他尽力鼓舞他们的士气。